That’s Precisely Why Farewell My Turnabout Is So So Important To Their Relationship. It’s The Case

Honestly, to me Manfred seems like he would be too rational to spend time on hating a group of people like that. He's extremely obsessed with "perfection" and looking back on Turnabout Goodbyes, he's also ruthlessly efficient. He prides himself on finishing trials in mere minutes and when Phoenix exposes his crime, all he does it tell the judge to hurry up with putting him away. He only acts irrationally when his "perfection" is threatened, namely when he shot Gregory over a penalty. And he puts a lot of effort into regaining his composure (taking the only vacation of his career after his crime). And adding all that on top of everything OP said about him raising Franziska... Manfred being misogynistic just doesn't seem very consistent with canon.

It's really easy to hate Manfred if you love Miles or Franziska and there is nothing wrong with interpretations, but I would recommend taking a good look at the evidence in canon.

Kinda scared to post this, but this has been on my chest for years and I finally have a platform to air it out. I don’t understand people who think that manfred is misogynistic. I know it’s like the cool thing to do in the aa fandom to hate manfred for fanon reasons, but I think manfred being misogynistic is one of the most unrealistic ones for me. Especially since Franziska turning out to be, well, Franziska, indicates otherwise. Like, Franziska is a loud, outspoken, confident, man-hating lesbian with anger issues that scares tf out of people. Basically everything that men hate. If manfred was misogynistic he would’ve snuffed that out as soon as he could. But he doesn’t. Bc he lives for that shit. I highly doubt he would try to constantly bring her down bc she’s a woman and “manfred wanted a male heir” (a fanon idea I also don’t understand since the competition that she and miles had together was started between them, and not directly initiated by manfred at all). Franziska being the way the she is literally can’t be more fitting of Manfred’s ideal of a von karma.

I just think it’s funny that manfred raised an angry lesbian daughter, is supposedly a wife guy (aai2), and overall has never said anything directly misogynistic in the games and the aa fandom chose him to be the misogynist of all people just bc he’s a villain. Really feels like the only reason people do that is bc they hate him so much they pile quite literally every horrible human trait they can think of onto him, and not bc it’s actually justified based on his character….

I don't know if this has been talked about before, but I really disliked the way the Careers were characterised in sotr. They felt like more of a caricature than in thg1, even if they were the minor antagonists in both. But they seemed more believable in thg1, although they had less lines. More competent? Like, if they trained for the Games for years, why would they be so airheaded? If it were up to me I'd make sure my volunteers were both strong and bright. And teach them how to prepare for the interviews!

And them always being the bully stereotype misses out on really interesting topics. For sure fame is one of the motivators, they're teens made to believe the Games are the highest honour, but why do they always have to be fame seeking brutes? Why don't we ever see them from the angle of training to protect the younger or sick kids from their district, even if it's just implied? If someone is guaranteed to volunteer each year in the career districts, the non career kids have stress-free teens (unless there's a QQ twist, I guess). They can take all the tesserae they need because it doesn't really matter how many times your name is in the bowl, their parents need not worry, no one's starving...

Idk, I guess all these things can be implicit because we know the system, and it makes sense they're minor antagonists because we seem them from a non career pov. But. I feel like there's a lot of missed opportunities world building wise when it comes to Career districts; not in a way that woobifies them (they're not the most oppressed district if such a thing can be compared, although, they're still district yk) it's just!!! interesting stuff that makes sense and I wish it was more present. I have more to say but this post will be more of a jumbled mess than it already is lol.

I'm sorry but as much as I love and ship narumitsu, Miles's "unnecessary feelings" line is primarily about him questioning his morals and methods as a prosecutor. Miles who was believed he was doing good and enacting justice by getting guilty verdicts for all defendants, who lost faith in finding the truth because he couldn't trust anyone anymore. He was shown that the truth is not so unobtainable by Phoenix, and he began to question if he was truly doing the right thing all along. That's why I love the "unnecessary feelings" line so much; it marks the start of Miles's redemption arc.

Of course you can headcanon the "unnecessary feelings" line to have romantic implications. But Klavier gets my vote in this case.

This. Is absolutely perfect. “This isn’t a fairy tale, Wright” !!! I feel like people are forgetting something about narumitsu most of the time. Edgeworth dismantling Phoenix’s misbeliefs and savior complex in 2-4. It’s equally as important and Phoenix dismantling Edgeworth’s misbeliefs and guilt in 1-4. You cannot just have Phoenix saving Edgeworth all the time.

savior complex

One core trait of Phoenix Wright as a character that I rarely see discussed is how utterly evasive he is about his private affairs. It sticks out the most in AA4 when we see Phoenix from the outside, but "Phoenix won't tell anyone anything important unless he absolutely has to (and even then, he probably won't)" is by no means a new development for him.

From AA1 onwards, we see Phoenix dodge people's questions about his personal life time and time again. In part, this is by narrative necessity - Phoenix knows more than the player is meant to know in order to achieve the optimal tension curve. But AA takes his narrative shortcut and turns it into a real character beat.

Phoenix Wright is the most cagey fucker on the planet.

At the end of 1-1 Mia asks him how he came to befriend Larry and Phoenix dodges the question with a vague promise to tell her later - this also means that in all of his time working with Mia, he's never actually disclosed his full motivation for becoming a lawyer to her.

In 1-2, Maya asks him how he knows Edgeworth and he dodges, because of course he does. The same song and dance repeats at the end of 1-3. And despite Maya's repeated prodding by 1-4, Phoenix still has not told her a thing about his past. That's from October until December that Maya is left going ??? and her questions go nowhere.

Then, between AA1 and AA2, Edgeworth is presumed dead by suicide. Does Phoenix tell Maya about this? Absolutely not. He does not tell her in letters nor is he clear about it when they see each other again in person, months later.

What Maya gets once it's inevitable to talk is a vague 'he's gone' and no elaboration other than the request to not speak about him again.

This is Phoenix's default coping mechanism.

In AA3, there are numerous instances where he mentions forgetting Dahlia, not speaking her name again, etc. Edgeworth is 100% getting the 'person who hurt me too deeply to think about' treatment here.

But to not even tell Maya a vague overview on the matter, when Maya knew him too? Rough. And it just keeps going.

It's six months between telling Maya that Edgeworth is 'gone' in 2-2 and her finding out that 'gone' seemingly means' dead' in 2-3.

Maya complains about it, too. This isn't a matter of 'she never asked again', it's a matter of 'Phoenix is dodging all questions'. Gumshoe has to intervene in order for Maya to finally find out.

And finally in 3-5, does he tell anybody why he's going to Hazakura temple and why he seems interested in Iris? Absolutely not!

At this point we get Edgeworth openly acknowledging that Phoenix keeps his emotional cards extremely closely to the chest. When he states that he wants confirmation on whether or not he has met Iris before, this exchange happens:

Even as Edgeworth directly calls him out on being evasive and never actually speaking to people, all Phoenix can do is acknowledge that this is how he is by apologizing - but he won't change his ways.

AA4 Phoenix is really just a natural evolution of Trilogy Phoenix - Trilogy Phoenix is already evasive, already hates telling people about his struggles or accepting help... It's really no wonder that he'd isolate himself instead of reaching out once he gets disbarred.

I think Miles feeling like his father would be disappointed in him is far more interesting if he came to that conclusion by himself instead of being "taught" to believe so by an external factor or being somehow trained to be something Gregory would have "hated" (and let's be real, Gregory would not flip a switch and hate anybody for anything, let alone his son).

Miles feeling like this by himself means there was a moment of self-reflection, even if that reflection did not reach the actually correct conclusion. It offers opportunities to explore how his brain works, themes of survivors guilt and grief that linger long after dl-6. That's interesting! That's intriguing!

What do you get from deciding there was some grand plan to form him into "a person Gregory would hate" (despite the obvious problems with that logic in the first place)? Cartoon villainy I guess? That's not very fun to explore...

His Trust...

Someone finally said it!!! Edgeworth is a very nuanced character. He is more than his trauma, his "unnecessary feelings" for Phoenix, or his emotional constipation. Narumitsu is not a one-sided Phoenix saves Edgeworth all the time dynamic. They're equals! Does Edgeworth's insistence in Farewell My Turnabout that Phoenix is not a hero mean nothing? I want to do like a proper analysis of this sometime, probably after I finish Trials & Tribulations...

okay here’s a secret for you guys: i actually prefer mtnr over nrmt

im not even sure why LMAO the second i started shipping nrmt i automatically pictured miles as the top like it just came naturally to me ig?

idk what it is about him that comes off that way to me but in all the ships i like the serious character is automatically a top for me so..

and because of that i got genuinely suprised when i found out that bottom!miles was way more popular in fanart/fics than i initially thought

like i didn’t mind at first because im not THAT obssessed with top/bottom dynamics i didn’t care too much about that stuff as long as it’s a ship i like and i’ll forever be grateful and happy that i get to see content of my fav ship everyday regardless of it’s specific contents/character dynamics it’s just a personal preference that’s all <3

but ngl there are times where i get kinda miffed about how miles *specifically* is protrayed in these fanworks because they always… woobify him? and don’t get me wrong ur free to protray him however u want pls don’t let me stop u this is only my opinion😭

they always baby him too much and take away his most defining traits like his ruthlessness and intelligence so they could turn him into this oh so angsty sad little boy who cannot intuit any emotion that’s not sadness or grief and needs to be taught how to feel happy by phoenix all the time as if he isn’t capable of doing it himself and needs to be handheld constantly

idk about u guys but miles’ character isn’t just about him struggling with unecessary feelings or missing his dad or whatever and yes that’s a huge part of him but what im saying is that’s not the ONLY big part of miles as a character

let’s not forget this is the same dude who told someone he didn’t gaf if they k worded themselves and he spent the last couple years prior to reuniting with phoenix SENDING INNOCENT PEOPLE TO JAIL OR POSSIBLY EVEN GETTING THEM THE DEATH PENALTY like this man’s ruthless as shit even after his character arc which really shows that von karma’s influence will forever be a part of him no matter how much he changed😭 he’s not evil or malicious but he’s not ur “sweet and sad widdle boy who we must protecc🥺” either

i dont like it when ppl dumb down this ruthless, intelligent and traumatized man to “aww my poor sad widdle baby” no offense but that’s not miles anymore that’s a whole ahh oc atp LMAOOO

I absolutely LOVE it tho when people dive into his darker side it’s such a refreshing thing to see ppl do with his character like YES give me more fics where miles is willing to bend the law if it's gets in the way of the truth, and it has ACTUALLY HAPPENED BEFORE!!!

it’s also another reason why i like mtnr because the fans of that dynamic actually DO explore this side of him a lot more where he’s more in control of everything and just takes charge and does whatever tf he wants without caring about what others think it’s a really nice change for once LOL but said fanworks are few and really hard to find

and also ppl always think miles is the most law-abiding citizen in society or whatever but i think that's bcuz him being prosecutor (one of the best too) and how much he loves his job automatically means that he’ll follow the rules to the ends of the earth or something but it’s been shown multiple times that he cares more about the truth than law itself ESPECIALLY if said law prevents him from knowing what really happened

sorry if this comes off as mean and i genuinely do not have a problem with ooc protrayals hell i LOVE ooc fanworks they’re super fun and i eat those shit up like a full course meal it’s just that miles get babied by the fandom so much more than phoenix does and hardly anyone ever talks about his morally gray side that’s willing to commit literal crimes to bring the truth to light in favor of turning him into the poster boy for ace attorney angst and it just kinda annoys me sometimes💀

this was supposed to be me talking about nrmt dynamics but it turned into a miles character analysis(?) instead… whoops

perfectionist (pt. 2)

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tag as ship for an instant block theyre siblings you freaks

Narumitsu enamel pin design!

Will produce it if enough people are interested 🫡