Out Of Curiosity, What Are The Major Rebuttals To The "Melina = GEQ" Theory?

Rykard and the Night of the black knives.

Y’know after thinking about it for a while, I think Rykard's involvement in the night of the black knives could run a little deeper than just being a co conspirator. What if he was the person who actually did the deed?

Not on Godwyn mind you, we already know that was all the black knife assassins handy work. But there is one other corpse that is left unaccounted for.

What if he was the one who killed Ranni and carved the cursemark into her back?

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I know there’s no evidence in game that says anything about this but… it had to have been someone right? Someone other than Ranni I mean. She’s metal as fuck, but it would have been incredibly hard to carve such a specific symbol into her own back. Especially since failure would mean certain death. 

And I also don’t think it would have been some random black knife assassin either. It’s certainly possible but looking at everything revolving them, their alliance seemed shaky at best, and they may not have even known about Ranni's half of the plot to begin with. No, I don't think she would have trusted them to do it. But I do believe she’d trust Rykard. They were already in on this together, and assuming he wasn’t part of the heist itself then there’s only really one other role he could have played in the event. 

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And going off of purely in game mechanics, he definitely has the stats to wield a black knife blade. If you compare the stat requirements for the black knife and Rykards own blasphemous blade, then they match up pretty well. He would be able to use one.

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And then we've got Ranni's body itself, which is burnt beyond recognition. Which is strange for a black knife killing, since they have no inherent fire damage, and while they do seem to have some sort of burning affect, it's never as bad as how scorched Ranni's corpse is. We never see this sort of damage done by a black knife again.

This leads me to believe that Ranni's body may have been burnt after the fact. Possibly as one final middle finger to the Two Fingers and the GW for trying to control her fate. One last 'fuck you' by desecrating the holy flesh they bestowed upon her.

And who do we know that has access to fire powers? Or more specifically Magma powers?

Rykard. The lord of blasphemy himself.

Your honour, I rest my case.

It just hit me that this mass bewitchment ability we see in the trailer is almost definitely an incantation, judging by what looks to be a golden seal in the tarnished's hand.

Which has got me thinking. Miquella has ties to both the bewitching branches ability and incantations, which means this is very likely an incantation connected to Miquella in someway, even possibly being a reward for his remembrance.

I'm not sure I like the implications that Miquella has a bewitchment spell that works on summons/spirit ashes that he could use against us in a possible fight.

One thing I’ve been thinking about recently that I just cannot get out of my head is why Marika shattered the elden ring? I mean, it’s all well and good to just say “Oh it’s because she was driven mad by the death of Godwyn of course” but I just don’t think that’s quite right. Not only does it feel weird to assume the shattering was just some spur of the moment decision done in an emotional outburst when it was very clearly planned in quite a lot of detail but it also doesn’t really add up with the timeline since Godfrey was presumably sent out of the lands between long before Godwyn died and that seems to be a massive part of what Marika’s plan was.

I think I’ve come up with a semi possible alternative reason as to what could have driven Marika to destroy her own order.

Ok hear me out here.

What if she instead betrayed her order because of what happened to her omen children? I mean, think about it. They are still her children after all and she had to abandon both of them as infants to a life of hell because the greater will (or the golden order, could be both) doesn’t like Omens.

We know that the GW was a pretty controlling (and rather petty) god when it was in power so it definitely had the ability and motive to strong arm Marika into doing things she wouldn’t want to. Even if she did want to keep the twins with her, what choice would she have had with that sort of being looming over her head 24/7?

Imagine how much that would destroy your faith in a system. Her own children, subjected to a life of pain and ridicule because of the way they were born all because her god (or society) says so.

I find it hard to believe that she wouldn’t at least have some conflicted feelings over the whole ordeal.

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I think the biggest evidence I have here is the fact that the omen twins were not only gifted greatrunes upon the rings shattering (something only granted to Marika’s offspring) but Morgott was even ‘given grace’, which is something Marika has a lot of control over.

Even after being born omens and being abandoned early on in their lives Marika still considered them enough of her kin to be given a chance in the shattering race. Now you could argue that them getting their greatrunes was just a happy accident but I really don’t think the same could be said about Morgott being grace given. That seems like a very conscious decision.

We can even see that Godfrey himself had some sense of fondness (or at least respect) for Morgott from the way he holds and speaks to him in his opening boss cutscene, is it really so out of the question that Marika may have felt the same?

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TLDR

What if Marika having to abandon her Omen children because of the greater will and golden order was the catalyst that began her plot to shatter the ring and end her own order?

This is an idea I've been thinking about for a while now. I find it really suspect that despite the fact Godwyn is presumably the only demigod who has canonically reproduced the "usual way", meaning that he must have had a partner at some point there's absolutely zero details about any sort of consort to Godwyn anywhere in the game. It's as if there's been a conscious effort by the Golden order to cover up any sort of information on that part of his life.

Take that and combine it with Godwyn and Fortissax's very close yet very vague companionship and Godrick's thing with the dragon and I think there's a real case to be made for those two having been together at some point.

Like who else could realistically have been the secret companion to Godwyn which has seemingly been entirely erased from history if not a past enemy of the golden order, Fortissax themselves.

Godrick is 100% Godwyn’s son with Fortissax. And his frail body is due to the dragon blood attempting to change him like it does when you do dragon communion, but his demigod blood prevents a natural evolution. It is also why he can easily graft the young dragon onto him and make full command of it.

Kinda ridiculous how every member of the pines family has “selfishness” as a key part of their character but Mabel is the only one that frequently gets attacked by the wider community for it.

Like, Ford found out he essentially created a universe devastating weapon and his top priority was to hide his blueprints for it instead of just destroying it because even though it was a tool of mass destruction it was still his research and life's work.

Stan is... Well Stan, a running joke in the series is him being a massive con-man and thief, and while it was for altruistic reasons, he was still willing to risk the universe's safety by reactivating the portal to get Ford back.

And Dipper is constantly willing to risk other people's happiness and safety for a chance of impressing the ones he looks up to. He manipulated time to get a shot at impressing Wendy, hurting Mabel and getting Blenden falsely imprisoned in the process. He used the size-changer thing to grow taller than Mabel because he was upset she was taller than him and literally raised the dead and almost got everyone killed to prove to the agents that he was telling the truth.

To reiterate my first point, each and every member of the pines family is incredibly selfish in one way or another, but that doesn't make them bad people, it just makes them people. So maybe we shouldn't be too mad at one character specifically for showing traits that they all have.

It's so unfair that they dropped Nightreign halfway through the game awards because there was no way I'd be able to pay attention to the rest of the show after that reveal 😭😭😭

From the moment the trailer dropped my memory of everything afterwards becomes more and more of a blur.

He gave me bad vibes from the very beginning tbh.

Like, after killing mad donkey P seems to be in some sort of shock/conflicted state as he stares down at his bloody hands (likely because that was the first human he had to kill) and Geppetto just doesn't acknowledge this at all. He doesn't even seem to register that his puppet, someone he sees as his own son has just killed in his defence.

Which imo reads at them being slightly misaligned from the start.

P is silently processing that he just killed a person (showing the first major flicker of emotion from him) and Geppetto doesn't even bat an eye at this fact.

I could see this tiny little dissonance between them growing larger if the two are faced with similar problems in the future.

Ok i have to share toughts but Lets talk about Geppetto, in convinced that somehow that guy is gonna play the villain role AT LEAST IN A FINALE. The idea of him being a good dad its cute yes, but think about the first lop trailer.

THE LAUGH-? THE FACT THAT HE TOOK DOWN AN WHOLE AS ANGEL? And again THE EVIL LAUGH AT THE END? No no guys, he doesnt give me a good vibe at all

desperate to do a Mohg deep dive after all the DLC content on him. There's just... so much.

Ansbach's entire demeanour seems completely backwards compared to modern Mohgwyn loyalists we know of. He holds Mohg is such incredibly high regard, and is probably one of, if not the most respectful warrior in a fromsoft game. Were the other pureblood knights like this? What happened to them? Why is Ansbach the only one left?

What could Mohg have been like to install such loyalty and respect in one of his followers, to the point where they'd face a newly born god just to do right in his name?

What caused Ansbach to decide to challenge Miquella in the first place? What tipped him off that Mohg was being used? How long were they interacting before this happened?

Was the Mohgwyn Dynasty always a vicious murder cult? was their once more to the group before Mohg's charming? If there wasn't, why didn't Miquella use his bewitchment of Mohg to stop it? Did he indorse Mohg's actions? Did he incite them.

Queen Marika the eternal and the power of bewitching

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Y'know, it's interesting that Marika also seemed to have a similar "mind control" power that Miquella is often sited as having.

"The Empyrean Miquella is loved by many people. Indeed, he has learned very well how to compel such affection."

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While it's something that isn't heavily explored in game (to the point where I don't see anyone discussing it) Roderika theorizes that Marika cursed Hewg to eternally craft weapons for the remainder of his life. And it's straight up stated that this "cursing power" was used on the fire giant to force it into protecting the giants forge in the name of the erdtree.

"The Fire Giant is a survivor of the War against the Giants. Upon realizing the flames of their forge would never die, Queen Marika marked him with a curse. "O trifling giant, mayest thou tend thy flame for eternity.""

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So Marika definitely seems to have a similar power, possibly even being the person Miquella inherited his off of in the first place.

But could this go even further than just Hewg and the fire giant? How many others could she have cursed over the years? What are the chances that Radagon suddenly up and leaving his family to become second elden lord wasn't actually his decision at all? Miriel himself states that it's a ongoing mystery as to why Radagon would do it.(alongside why he was chosen to become elden lord at all)

"The mystery endures, to this day... As to why Lord Radagon would cast Lady Rennala aside... and moreover...why a mere champion would be chosen for the seat of Elden Lord"."

The thing I find really important is that the question isn't just about why he'd be chosen as elden lord, but also why he'd cast Rennala aside at all. To me, this implies that Radagon did indeed care for Rennala, to the point where even with the temptation of becoming the second lord of the order he loved so much, it still seemed strangely out of character for him to take that opportunity over his family. As if he would never do that.

That is unless, he didn't take that opportunity by choice.

Afterall, even after leaving Rennala, he still clings to the only thing he has left of her, the golden order greatsword. And on top of that, he left his red wolf to protect her from harm, and even gifted her the amber egg before his departure. (Though I'd argue that that did far more bad than good for her mental state.)

"Telltale signs betray that this was once the greatsword bequeathed to him by his first wife, Rennala."

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Ok so Radagon could have been cursed by Marika, and much like Hewg with his smithing and the fire giant with the forge, Radagon might have been cursed to protect the golden order as its elden lord, which would eventually backfire horrendously when Marika decided to turn against that very same order.

Admittedly I am kind of stretching here but everyone she cursed seems to be "cursed" with a specific goal in mind. Forge a god slaying weapon, Protect the giants forge. So it's not totally out of the question that she also cursed Radagon with the goal of "be the elden lord."

It would certainly explain why even after years trapped in the tree and barely even being alive anymore, he still fought tooth and nail to protect his order. He cannot give up because he's no longer physically capable of giving up. Much like Hewg and the giant. That is unless they die of course.

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But it could go even further than that. What about Maliketh? It appears he's just loyally following the orders of Marika but that's what it always looks like! It looks like that with Hewg. It looks like that with the fire giant and it looks like that with Maliketh aswell. Despite seeming utterly miserable both as Maliketh and Gurranq, he carries on following her orders for years.

We have no idea how long he spent in the Farum Azula. Time doesn't work properly there. For all we know, he could be the oldest being in the game by the time we get to him. And yet after all that time his resolve never wavers. Even after being "betrayed" by Marika.

"Maliketh was a shadowbound beast given to his Empyrean. Marika's sole need of her shadow was a vessel to lock away Destined Death. Even then, she betrayed him."

And much Like Hewg, Fire Giant and Radagon, Maliketh is also ordered to carry out a specific goal. Which is protecting destined death.

Forge the god slaying weapon.

Protect the Giants Forge.

Be elden lord.

Guard Destined death.

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Many people, including myself have sited Miquella's connection to the bewitching branch and power to "compel affection" as evidence that he might not be as benevolent as he seemed. But what if we've got it all wrong? What if we shouldn't be being suspicious of Miquella for having this power, but instead the person he inherited it off of?

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Now there is someone else that Marika may have cursed. Well, a group of someone's actually. I saved this till the end because it's the most "out there" part of this theory but...

Spoken echoes of Queen Marika linger here as well.

Shall I share them with you?

In Marika's own words.

Hear me, Demigods. My children beloved. Make of thyselves that which ye desire. Be it a Lord. Be it a God. But should ye fail to become aught at all, ye will be forsaken. Amounting only to sacrifices...

...What if it wasn't the power from shards of the elden ring that corrupted the Demi-gods and led to the shattering wars?

What if it was the power of suggestion? The power of bewitchment?

What if it was Marika?

I just realised that this idea also tracks with their remembrance. The remembrance we receive from beating them isn’t “remembrance of the promised consort” or “remembrance of the kind” it's “remembrance of a god and a lord” it’s Radahn(Mohg) and Miquella together, as one.

It’s the only remembrance in the entire game that names multiple beings in its title, and to my knowledge, the only one that grants items related to different characters.

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This is sort of an unrelated thought but It’s also worth mentioning that in its description it refers to its owner as “Radahn, consort of Miquella” as if it were one being it was related to, despite it clearly being two. Which reminds me of how Godfrey is in some capacity, Serosh and Hoarah Loux together as one. Neither is ultimately more or less important in making up “Godfrey” as the other. Which could also further explain the striking similarities between Godfrey and Consort of Miquella.

Thinking about how Miquella and Radahn as a single boss are the perfect representation of all 3 demigod sibling groups.

Miquella - Marika & Radagon

Radahn - Rennala & Radagon

Mohg - Marika & Godfrey

Not only that but they also represent all 3 magic types. 

Faith - Miquella’s holy magic

Intelligence  - Radahn’s gravity magic

Arcane - Mohg’s bloodflame magic

The 3 of them converge into one being. Mohg’s body, Radahn’s soul and Miquella’s mind all working in perfect harmony. To become one.