Free My Girl. She Did All That But So Did A Male Character And Nobody Cared

also old but gold, still love that thing

This aligns exactly with what Edgeworth said at the end of Turnabout Goodbyes.

“For the longest time, I thought that I might have killed my own father. I thought I might be a criminal. I became a prosecutor in part to punish myself”

Edgeworth projected himself onto every defendant he prosecuted. It was probably the only way he could live with himself.

replaying 1-2 and it’s finally clicked that edgeworth thinking phoenix could murder mia was less about phoenix and almost entirely about him, who’d been living with the knowledge he killed his father despite loving him, idolizing him, and constructing his world view around him. edgeworth indicting phoenix for his mentor’s murder was one of the biggest signs he’d been carrying a guilty conscience for the past 15 years of his life.

Oh 100% Phoenix has major abandonment issues and a massive savior complex. He isn’t a defense attorney for himself, and he probably has little to no identity outside of it.

Comparing Phoenix’s issues to Adrian Andrews’ “dependent nature” is quite fitting really. The parallels between them are so interesting.

They both obsessed with someone close to them and modeled part of their career after them (Adrian acting like Celeste as a manager, Phoenix becoming a lawyer to save Edgeworth). They are both devastated when said person leaves them. They both forsake the truth because they are too dependent on someone else (Adrian forging evidence and Phoenix trying to get Engarde acquitted). And at the end of 2-4 they are both saved by the truth (when Edgeworth shows them the meaning of trust and finding the truth).

the more I think about phoenix wright the more convinced I am of how deeply fucked up he is

His Trust...

Phoenix believes in people but he doesn't trust them, oh my god you're so right. I think it's more so that he believes in the ideal, rather than the person themselves, at least as time goes on or for people he doesn't know well. The ideal of being an attorney, the ideal that people need to be saved.

I think what I love the most about AA is that characters have a duality to them that I don't see often in media. They have actual flaws and do actual bad things, and it's not glossed over. Phoenix is a fundamentally good person, he helps people at the drop of a hat, risks his life for them. Has a penchant for taking strays under his wing. He believes in people... but also not really. He carries a literal lie detector with him at all times, and only employs people who can also peer into other people's hearts. So is he really that trusting? Sure he trusts his clients are innocent, but he doesn't trust they will tell him the truth at all (there's always something to lie about). He believes himself naive, and that's why he works extra hard not to be. Some people think he changed with his disbarment but I feel like when he actually changed was after Dahlia. He became less and less trusting as time went on. And Phoenix actually does forge evidence and risks his subordinate's career, and he says pretty nasty things sometimes (that one time to Edgeworth had got to hurt, badly, especially if you consider that the note could have been genuine at first, which we don't know for sure), has a pretty tactless and somewhat hurtful sense of humor, brings his daughter to cheat at poker, and doesn't tell said daughter she actually has some family left alive. He's secretive, elusive and cryptic, and masks it under a false pretence of goofiness. Miles is, by contrast, very easy to read. He may appear emotionally stunted but is one of the more emphathetic characters. He realizes when he's wrong and immediately needs to correct those wrongs. He grows uneasy and uncertain and eventually recognizes when he's mistaken. By the end of it he begins to help people naturally, without even thinking about it as much as he would have in the past. He helps so many people, he has basically got Phoenix's savior complex 2.0 but the healthy kind where he doesn't jump off a bridge. But... he was also actually cruel, and did send innocent people to their graves (was he really so naive to believe whichever defendant came his way was guilty?). He feigned his death disregarding other people's feelings, and while you could say he had no obligation towards Phoenix (apart from basic decency and respect towards someone who had turned his life around to save him), he still abandoned Franziska, who was still just a kid and had just discovered her father was a psychopath. She probably thought, at some point, that the apple didn't fall that far from the tree. That's it's somehow her fault as well. He may be rude and antagonistic, frank to a fault. Isn't afraid of telling stuff to your face. But he also cares about the people he loves so much, to the point he doesn't hesitate to risk his career and break the law multiple times. He may appear a pessimist but he's pretty idealistic at heart, it's quite funny that his favourite show is about an hero of justice, isn't it? Godot is... well, we don't know much about it from before his coma, but he definitely shared Mia's sentiments for helping people in their hour of need. But when he wakes from a 6-year coma he's so broken that he just pins the blame on the most absurd person to blame it on, settles on a complicated plan, and also prosecutes on that particular murder he should just confess upon. Iris was sweet, innocent, self-sacrificing. She knew absolutely nothing about the world apart from what Bikini or her sister told her. She was naive and falsely thought she could fix everything, that her sister was salvageable, that she could save Phoenix. But she still ended up lying to the person she loved and abetting a murder. That's why I love these characters so much. They're interesting and their stories make sense. People don't remain unchanged from what happens to them. People are multi-faceted and complex. You can't sum them up in a bunch of characteristics and aspect them to act on every single one of them, always, consistently. Sometimes people break. They make mistakes they regret, ...and some they don't.

This is literally how I view the wrightworth relationship progression through the trilogy.

Phoenix is 100% more emotionally constipated than Edgeworth is and I will stand by that.

Space to share a headcanon you rotate in your brain like a rotisserie chicken

I have a very specific idea how the mitsunaru ship dynamic goes:

Also that one headcanon about Phoenix suppressing his college self means everything to me...

The idea of him getting back to that mentality for a moment and trying to backpedal out of embarrassment is just

When I think about Larry in AA3 I wonder if the writer suddenly decided they didn't like him that much and decided to make it known in the game to the point where it bleeds to the characters (both Phoenix, especially him! and Edgeworth seem to see him as the 'annoying ass friend') and himself by flanderizing him or if this was an genuine decision to see how a person's life can go downhill over time and tried to make it funny.

Honestly I think it's the former (writers decided they didn't like Larry anymore), because I don't necessarily think Larry's life is going downhill. He found his talent in art with a mentor and he's attempting to become a better person... only for his mentor to then die. If it were anyone else this would spark some sort of meaningful character arc... but it doesn't. The game just turns Larry into more of a laughing stock. I don't get it, truly. They drop so much information about his trauma but it's treated like a joke. Phoenix and Miles don't even act like they care about him as a friend anymore... just why??

Also I do believe writers' attitudes towards characters often bleed into the writing and then bleed into fan perception.

I’ve been getting into Ace Attorney! Scene from Farewell My Turnabout (no spoilers tho pls, I haven’t finished the case yet)

This is further evidence for my point that that Edgeworth has a “move on” attitude towards trauma and the past. After his father’s death, he pushed down his grief and guilt to pursue guilty verdicts. He probably did everything he could to forget his old life. Even now, he doesn’t dwell on the past, the difference is his goal is no longer so unhealthily single-minded.

He buries his emotions not for the sake of hiding them but to accomplish his goals.

(Edited to adjust my argument).

I think RTFA confirming that Miles Edgeworth didn't intentionally forge evidence aligns with his established character in the first four cases. It does take away some audience interpretation but personally I'm fine with that.

First of all I don't think the rest of AA1 ever confirmed it one way or the other. There are a few instances where Phoenix thinks of Edgeworth as an evidence forger but it's not like Phoenix would know for sure either. (Do correct me, with specific lines please, if I'm wrong though).

But more importantly, if you only look at the first four cases of AA1 Edgeworth being an evidence forger doesn't make sense with his character. Why would a prosecutor forge evidence? Not including reasons like being blackmailed. 1) If they don't care (enough) about the truth (prioritizing things like success over it), or 2) if they truly believe the defendant is guilty and are desperate for a conviction (aka the reason Adrian Andrews forges evidence in 2-4).

Does Edgeworth care about the truth, before the start of his redemption arc at the end of 1-3?

Yes... kind of. I don't think he prioritizes the truth or consciously cares about it. As the "Demon Prosecutor", Edgeworth cares about justice, and achieving it through punishment. However, convicting the wrong person would not be justice to him. Which is what makes Edgeworth change sides to convict the right person in 1-3. So in that sense, he does care about the truth.

You could argue that Edgeworth had already lost once to Phoenix and thought "screw this, my perfect record is already gone, another loss wouldn't change that fact". But compare him to two characters who are actually obsessed with their perfect records. Manfred, a perfectionist control-freak, getting a penalty (not even losing!) unraveled him so much that he killed Gregory in the heat of the moment. Franziska after losing in 2-2 declares that: "That spirit channeling trial was a sham! I refuse to acknowledge its legitimacy! It did not count!" She doesn't even want to admit that she lost. Edgeworth, on the other hand, doesn't act like someone who truly prioritizes his win record over the truth.

Because Edgeworth didn't just let himself lose in 1-3, he made himself lose. He made Vasquez testify again. She would have gotten away if Edgeworth didn't say anything. And after the trial he tells the judge "Will Powers was innocent. That he should be found so is only natural… not a miracle."

Okay but if Edgeworth does care about the truth (to some extent), and believed that every defendant being guilty was the truth, he could have easily gone down the path of forging evidence to ensure the verdict reflected what he believed to be true. That leads me to my next question:

2. Does Edgeworth truly believe that every defendant he prosecutes is guilty?

Actually no. He says this in Turnabout Sisters: "Innocent"...? How can we know that? The guilty will always lie, to avoid being found out. There's no way to tell who is guilty and who is innocent! All that I can hope to do is get every defendant declared "guilty"! So I make that my policy.

Yeah I think that line speaks for itself.

Miles Edgeworth can't bring himself to consciously care about or prioritize the truth, but the moment it's presented in front of him he also can't bring himself to ignore it. He doesn't think it would be just to knowingly convict an innocent person, but he's so disillusioned and distrusting of people that he's lost faith in finding the truth.

So, he commits himself to getting guilty verdicts because he believes that's the best shot he has at enacting justice, even if he accidentally convicts innocent people from time to time.

And to me that aligns with his reaction to finding out he unknowingly used forged evidence in 1-5. Edgeworth was so disillusioned with finding the truth that he has accepted that some collateral damage would inevitably happen as a result of his mindset. However, because he still can't let go of his dedication to the truth, he wouldn't want to lie or rewrite the facts to achieve his verdicts.