Ask Your Local Transandrophobic Dirtbag Where They Were During The Ace Discourse Years Ago.

Calling me a transandrobro who believes in some kind of ideology is like calling the kid who pointed at the emperor and said "he's not wearing any clothes" a "clothes truther" who "clings to his dogmatic ideology." I do not care about ideology. I am just pointing out that you're fucking lying.

okay. so. this is clearly a terf post because no one can be this dense about transandrophobia without swallowing the terf pill, but in case anyone is actually thinking like this.

trans men are not trying to suggest that trans women are oppressing us. why is it that when we talk about a cisgendered society oppressing us, you assume we’re talking about trans women?? trans men talking about how a cisnormative and patriarchal society affects us has absolutely nothing to do with trans women, except to acknowledge that we’re all in the same boat and therefore need to stick together underneath hostile threats towards our community.

no we did not think transitioning would make the “gender prison” magically disappear, and that line of thinking blatantly shows that you subscribe to the terf idea that trans men only transition to “escape” womanhood, while believing that trans women are the only “real” trans people who transition because they have no other choice (huh… where have i heard discourse about what makes someone a “real” [insert marginalised group of people] before?)

trans people and their identities are not a political stance or commentary on gender. a trans man existing is not because they believe they magically have male privilege now or because they think men are better than women. male privilege and the patriarchy were designed by white, cis men for white, cis men. we do not have access to male privilege in the ways that cis men do, and we are accutely aware of this. none of us are whining about not gaining male privilege, because we’re reminded every single day every time our autonomy is violently stripped away from us that male privilege does not and will not include us.

this all also comes down to the problem of trans men being erased from history by historians treating us as “women who dressed up as men to escape the patriarchy” as opposed to actual trans people who existed alongside other trans people. because of this, there’s a subconscious idea that trans men and mascs are a recent phenomenon, almost like a subset of trans people that branched out from trans women, as opposed to being trans people in their own right. when we talk about our experiences and oppression, we’re met with this idea that everything we’re talking about is stuff that already exists for other people and we’re just co-opting it, as opposed to oppression we’ve historically been facing for as long as anyone else, but our erasure means that terms for these experiences do not get spread around nearly as much.

“transandrophobia” may be considered to be a new term, but the actual oppressions that trans men face on the basis of being trans men is not new. we’re just finally talking about it. and if you would actually read through the tag that you’re infiltrating and what trans men are actually saying, you’d learn what those oppressions are. the type of misogyny we face comes from the idea that we’re “defected” women and need to be “fixed”, and it’s the type of misogyny we experience from women, particularly white, cis women, who view Eurocentric ideas of womanhood and femininity as the ideal or men who want our bodies “restored” back into baby machines. our forced detransitioning and sterilisation is an extremely serious issue that deserves to be talked about, especially since forceful detransitioning is practically a death sentence for many trans people. “at least they don’t want to kill you” no they just want us to kill ourselves. that’s better i guess.

all this to say, trans men experience oppression in different ways to cis women and other trans people, because we are different people, and talking about those experiences does not harm trans women in any way. we are not speaking over trans women. we are not suggesting that trans women are in any way a threat to us. cisgender people who are upholding the gender binary and the patriarchy (and yes, that includes radfems) are a threat to us, in the same way that they’re a threat to trans women. we are all in the same boat. we just want to talk about the shit that we face and be listened to for once.

if you see this type of post, assume that it’s a terf. assume that it is a cisgendered terf, even if they claim to be part of the community, who is masquerading as a trans person in order to sow the seeds of discourse. even if I’m wrong, who cares. they’re getting blocked either way. terfs are trying to divide trans men and women right now, in the same way that men want them to divide cis women and trans women in order to distract them with infighting, and make trans men feel that they are not accepted or that their struggles are not real, so that they can groom trans men into detransitioning. people like OP are a threat to trans people. don’t fall for it.

jesus christ

It's kinda hard to not beef with your own community when people from that community are currently mad at you for existing and talking about your problems. Besides that people in the "anti-transmasculinity" crowd do talk about the issues that trans men & mascs face in society as a whole, not just from other trans people

This is the same logic as "takes two to tango". Refusing to mention intracommunity issues doesn't end those issues or unite the community, it just allows them to fester and for your experiences to be erased against. If you don't fight, yoy're sure to be beaten

If you understand as a trans man/transmasc etc. how upsetting it is to claim that trans men/transmascs etc. are especially and uniquely capable of transmisogyny you should then understand how upsetting it is to claim that trans women/transfems etc. are especially and uniquely capable of anti-transmasculinity.

Cis, perisex people are the main perpetrators of transphobia.

People are going to see "anti-transmasculinity" as transmisogynistic if you spend all your energy on your page complaining about the minority of trans women/ transfems who perpetuate it. And lets be honest, it's easier to call out trans women/ transfems because the internet loves to turn it's backs on trans women/ transfems rather than the cis people saying heinous transphobic shit. They are going to get the wrong idea of this term.

Stop engaging and feeding into the lateral violence and division of our communities. It is not helping anyone, and especially not our cause.

helpful venn diagram of people who are against the term transandrophobia for those of you who arent aware of whats going on right now

If you see a trans man speak up about his community in a discussion he has every right to be in, and your first instinct is to tell him he sounds like an MRA saying "What about men," then you are not an ally to trans men.

When you talk about trans history that impacted and impacts trans men, expect trans men to speak up about themselves. When you talk about reproductive justice, expect trans men to talk about themselves. When you talk about living under the patriarchy as a marginalized gender, expect trans men to speak up about themselves.

(I mean this in a very broad sense. Of course, when trans women are talking about things that are largely unique to them, bringing up trans men may not be the best way to engage with the conversation)

But anyway, the difference between Conservative MRA saying "What about men", and trans men voicing their experiences in conversations they are a part of (but have been forgotten in) is that MRA's purpose is to entirely ignore intersectional feminism. They want to say "Men have it bad too, so women need to stop complaining." They have no interest in a productive discussion that benefits themselves, and the women they are arguing with.

Trans men just want to be heard. We want to add to the conversation. We have a place in the conversation because we are a marginalized gender. We do not want to speak over anyone because our motivation is to not say "But we have it bad too, so stop complaining." Our motivation is to say "We have this same experience because we are a marginalized gender too."

If you can't distinguish between a trans man desperate to be listened to about his own issues for once, and cis men desperate to shut women up, then you need to reflect on your allyship

Nevermind this isn't staying a comment

Dawg, would you look at that??😯😰😨

A trans"woman" just admitted he is a man and threatened a woman for 'hurting his feelings'. His Y chromosome must be acting up again!

And of course it would be ridiculous to ever believe that transphobia and misogyny could ever intersect in a way specific to their trans identity

"trans men only ever experience transphobia and misogyny" and as we all know those two things never intersect (sarcasm)

"also please consider your intention when centering yourself using language like "equally threatened"" IM KILLING YOU WITH HAMMERS DO YOU HEAR YOURSELF RIGHT NOW

ofc the person saying intersex people can't be trans if they don't conform to the sex binary and mtf or ftm "standard" also recommends the platform that's actively erasing us intersex and transmasc people

and to archive their latest take on us: