Stop Treating Greek Mythology Like Just Another Fictional Franchise

Hold on a sec

"all in all the Hellenic Republic as we know it today is a very recent concept in the large scheme of theings"

I hope you're talking about the Hellenic Republic as in the nation-state (and even then, it's not that recent), and not the people.

Because Greeks, as in, the people, didn't appear 200 years ago, nor did we conjure up an ethnic identity the moment we became a nation-state (200 years ago). We've held and preserved our ethnic identity for thousands of years. We've been Greeks for thousands of years.

"And is not a race because people of different backgrounds can have the Greek citizenship"

First of all, let's not confuse 'nationality' with 'ethnicity'. What you're talking about here is Nationality Law, which is a thing in a lot of countries, not exclusively in Greece.

Let's say I, a Greek person, became a Nigerian citizen through naturalisation. And someone decided to make a movie/show about the Yoruba deities. By your logic, some of the gods in this movie/show could very well look like me, a Greek person, or a Swedish person who is a Nigerian citizen, or a Chinese person who is a Nigerian citizen, and so on and so on.

Do you see the problem?

"And it's not the same as whitewashing"

Excuse me, your logic here; this wrong thing (whitewashing) has been happening for a while, therefore we will fight it by also doing the wrong thing (casting/designing other characters inaccurately).

How is that going to help anyone? Two wrongs don't make a right.

You say "there's not a finite amount of representation" but then you essentially say misrepresention is fine as long as it's at the expense of specific groups of people.

Your US-centric concept of race doesn't apply to every other region in the world.

When you force 'fake' diversity unto Greek mythology, not only are you erasing Greeks as an ethnic group, you're also ignoring mythologies from other cultures and of other ethnic groups, in the process.

And I find it tactless of you to police what we look like and what kind of representation befits us, in stories taken straight from our culture.

"But let's humor them for a moment"

I'd advise you not to make assumptions for a country and a people (and a culture) you're clearly not familiar with.

Once again I saw people complaining about making Greek mythology things with people who have dark skin, because they aren't "ethnically Greek". But they actually mean "racially Greek" because Ethnicity is not just skin color, it also refers to a shared culture, customs, traditions etc etc, but I digress

And before annoying people on tumblr start sending me hate messages accusing me of being racist against Greek people (again lol) for saying that is not bad for something Greek mythology related to have a couple of Dark skinned characters out of the majority light skinned characters (coughHadescough) allow me to explain

Now, Greek isn't actually a race, all in all the Hellenic Republic as we know it today is a very recent concept in the large scheme of theings. And is not a race because people of different backgrounds can have the Greek citizenship

But let's humor them for a moment

I went to Google images to search for the average Greek person and these are the results:

Now, we see here the so called "ethnically correct" way to look Greek

Light olive skin, dark hair and brown eyes

The way Greeks look, right?

Well

Surprise assholes, they are all Mexicans JAJAJAJA

And what does that mean? Are Mexicans stealing the Greek look? Are those people in Mexico stealing representation by looking like that? Wait, it's all Mexico? Always has been

No, but seriously. What does that means?

It means that Light olive skin, dark hair and brown eyes... It's a pretty common look everywhere

Yeah, even in South Africa you're going to find people looking like that

Now, mind you, not all Mexicans look like that, there are Indigenous people, Afro Mexicans, wHite Mexicans, Chinese Mexicans, etc etc

And I'm sure there are people in the Hellenic Republic that look different, with lighter skin, with darker skin, you know the drill

But that's the thing, you can't assign just one right way to look to a country, if you start assigning a race to a nationality you're on your way to create an ethnostate (which is bad mind you)

And people who complain about dark people taking away representation from them. Honey; Representation is not something that has a finite amount, if you don't like how some people make Patroclus dark skinned, you can always make your own version or support an artist that makes a representation you like instead of complaining about people who make him "not ethnically correct"

(Mind you, making Patroclus wHite isn't bad and has been done before)

Besides, making something culturally accurate about Greek culture doesn't have anything to do with race, as culture doesn't equal race

Like if somebody made something about Mexico and put Afro Mexicans or Chinese Mexicans in there, it's not taking anything away from me, because there's not a finite amount of representation

And it's not the same as whitewashing, as people complain about whitewashing because there are already A LOT of things with white people in it, and plus, complaining about whitewashing does next to nothing, as it's still happening (like how in the most recent adaptation of wuthering heights they choose a white actor for a character that's implied to be Romani)

BTW, I lied, in the picture above, two people are Greek actually and 2 are mexican (allegedly, I just found the pictures on Google, so who know where they're from really, they could be from anywhere lmao)

If I had a penny for everytime my ship developed a psychic connection in their second movie together, I'd have two pennies. Which isn't a lot but it's weird that it happened twice.

Beetlejuice Fan Theory

Okay, so I’ve already shared this with several of you, but I thought it would be neat to post it here in case anyone out there was interested in adding on or joining the discussion. I am absolutely CONVINCED that Betelgeuse knew he was going to try and marry Lydia before the Maitlands ever summoned him. Here are the events as we know them to have passed:

Lydia spots the Maitlands through the window and they comment on it, in full view of the model. 

Lydia receives the skeleton key from Jane.

Cue Betelgeuse’s commercial. The Maitlands immediately leave for the Neitherworld. 

Lydia enters the attic, picks up the handbook, sits down, starts reading.

The Maitlands return three months later and Juno says “I believe he’s been sleazing around your cemetery.”

When the Maitlands FINALLY summon Beej, he goes out of his way to make it look like he’s still trapped in the model- but he’s not. He says to their faces “you want to get some people out of your house. I want to get SOMEBODY out of your house.“ 

From this point on until the end of the snake scene, when Barbara calls him back, Betelgeuse has free roam of the house. Juno even explicitly scolds the Maitlands, telling them “you took Betelgeuse out and you did not put him back!”(sidenote; I can’t help but wonder what he was doing during those hours)

Later, Delia comments that there’s no way anyone could get into the attic because it’s locked. This tells us that Lydia never turned over the skeleton key. Charles kept the study for himself. Lydia keeps the attic. 

We KNOW that Lydia never gave up the skeleton key. This means that if she did continue visiting the attic during those three months(of course she did, why wouldn’t she?) she would have had to sneak around to do it without arousing Delia’s suspicion(cause Delia would take the attic and turn it into a god awful trendy mess given the chance). Which means she was probably only there late at night… wink wink nudge nudge naughty, naughty girl ;)

PLEASE if anyone would like to add on to this, dispute my claims, or contribute a theory of your own, feel free to do so. 

unpopular opinion but with the new tide of Greek mythology stories and retellings, Greek Cultural Sensitivity Readings are absolutely necessary. We are in 2024, with thousands of fics and retellings out there!! How is this not a thing yet?? There's vast improvement one can achieve by working professionally on their text with a Greek. I've seen it so many times!!

Also, duh, I'm offering the service BUT I want you to know that the situation with the inaccuracies of SERIOUS works is so dire that initially I didn't even do it for money. As a writer I just wanted to... fix things, to set a new standard for writers and the industry that sells us the most heavily Americanized pop-culture material and passes it as "authentic vibes of Greek mythology". (And of course there were writers who wanted to do right by their story and they had reached out to me. So kudos to them as well!)

Okay, but why does Cultural Sensitivity Reading make a vast difference and it's not just smoke and mirrors?

As a Greek, I am tired of well-meaning writers and authors butchering very basic elements of my culture. It's not their fault exactly, since they were raised in another culture with a different perspective. And nobody clued them in on how different Greek culture is from theirs, so writers sometimes assume that their culture is the default and they project that into ancient Greece. (Even published professionals like Madeline Miller have written "UK or US in antiquity" (with a very colonialist flavor) instead of writing "Ancient Greece". (Looking at you, Circe!)

Even writers who researched a lot before coming to me still had a lot of misinformation or wrong information in their text, easily verifiable by the average Greek. Again, not their fault. They can only access certain information, which does not include Greek scholarly work and scientific articles that DO offer valuable context.

Translation, accuracy, and meaning: If you ever wondered what a word means or how to pronounce it, here's your chance! There are Greeks like me who are knowledgeable and have a keen interest in antiquity and they will be able to read and compare ancient texts, and dive deeper into the work of Greek scholars regarding those texts.

If you want to create new words, you can do that as well! (It doesn't always work, but we can try. Greek is a really rich language and has a word about everything) If you use existing words, I can help you separate reality from fantasy in the context of your story.

(Do not assume we Greeks are ignorant of our heritage, or that we don't know how to research! Our archaeology sector is huge and archaeological museums are closer to most of us than your local Target is to you)

I guarantee there are things you never thought about Greece and the Mediterranean - from the ancient to the modern era. Sprinkling elements like phrases, types of interactions, customs, songs, instruments, dances, etc , into your text will make your text absolutely rich in culture.

Names matter!!! The genders of the names matter, diminutives matter (If I see one more "Perse" for Persephone I will claw my eyes out along with a few thousand Greeks), naming traditions matter!!! In many cases you should not even use a diminutive!!

You will be able to write about a foreign culture easily! Because of the continuity of Greek culture, you can even write a few more recent Greek elements to fill in the gaps. I can make sure they are not mismatched, and they will complement your ancient setting. I have observed a few things I didn't know we had since antiquity, but they make sense because our land has certain characteristics.

Non-Greek writers often miss the whole context of Greek culture! Do you know how Greek respect towards deities and parents looks like? What tones we use when we talk to our elders? When to use honorific plural - if your setting is more modernized?

Oh, and please let's avoid caricatures when describing Greeks?? (even fantasy Greeks) There can be heavy exotisation and odd descriptions of Greeks, as if we are another species. Even in published works. For many western writers it's difficult to catch, unfortunately.

The whole process is actually way easier than you think. You send me a text, I make notes and then we have some discussion on your vision.

It's always okay to seek guidance from the locals! You are not "guilty" when you admit you don't know! How can you know if you don't ask?? You can't imagine what relief and "πάλι καλά!!!" I read/see from other Greeks when I tell them another foreigner is using me for cultural sensitivity? Greeks want you to seek help and will NOT shame you for it!

(On the contrary, you have no idea how many eye-rolls Greeks do when they see a blatantly wrong thing in a story... Which has happened pretty often for many years now. Can we do better as an industry?? Please???)

You can send me a personal message to share your story, or ask what this whole cultural sensitivity thing is all about, or ask about what I have done so far and how I can help. But for the love of all that's good, don't let your story be another "generic greek myth retelling"! And don't let others sell you their generic greek myth retellings!!

I like the idea of Ariadne meeting her mother in law. After Semele gets resurrected and becomes immortal, there's no doubt of them meeting together.

Imagine Semele spending time with her son she never got to hold as a baby, now being all grown up, married and with kids. She would love to spend time filling the gaps of their lost time.

She would love to help Ariadne with becoming a mother, nursing her kids and talking about their past lives when they were mortals. How Ariadne would feel more close to her, than she did with her actual mother.

How Dionysus would often stand there and admire the two most important women of his life being in the same room as him, happy and well.

Listen, they removed "I'm Wishing/One Song" and the "One Song" reprise.

It was bound to flop, they had it coming.

In Greece, the 25th of March is a day of great religious and national importance. Along with the celebration of the Annunciation of the Virgin Mary, it is the Greek Independence Day, when is celebrated and commemorated the symbolic declaration in the monastery of Agia Lavra (Achaia,Peloponnesus) of the revolution against the Ottoman Turks, occupants of Greece. Thus began the Greek War of Independence (1821-1830),which would lead to the gradual liberation of Greece and the creation of the modern Greek state.

The countless heroic and tragic episodes of this long and bloody war,and   many of its extraordinary protagonists, have inspired through time many artists,both European and Greek, to create portraits, sprawling battle scenes and introspective historical works.

These are some of them.

Click on the works to see the title and artist.

This is a series,and this is part 2.

Oh no she actually mentioned using Ovid, Shakespeare's Ulysses, and other sources in an interview.

Oh neat..

However Ovid does not depict Circe being assaulted in his work thankfully. Her stories center around her unrequited love, jealousy, and the consequences of her powerful magic. The focus is on her role as a sorceress who transforms others, not as a victim.

That's a main difference that Miller has been making in her works is the useless plot device of using women's suffering and trauma for shock value.

Like miller you are ruining the source material and the image of those old poets.

The Rise of Skywalker: a Review

what the what

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