Funnily Enough I Think Geto Has Much More Chances Of Alter The Course Of Time Than Gojo Does, Because

You should add Six as the middle child!

Nine is the big bro who keeps the house in order, Six is the chaotic and charismatic middle child, Tenko is the little brat.

I'm going to leave here some old drawings of nine + afo because yes

( is this some kind of headcanon? I think so! and it's the delusional headcanon type😓)

You forgot to add a very important reason of why Sukuna is more universally beloved by pretty much the entire JJK fandom, whereas in MHA there's no villain who really fits this criteria (at least no serious villains because you can't count Gentle in this lmao).

Anyway, this reason is simply that Sukuna narrative role is pretty much perfectly defined and almost never deviates from being an evil bastard without almost any redeeming feature. Unlike Shigaraki for example, who is more or less the 2nd more appreciated villain behind Dabi, and the narrative constantly goes back and forth between him being pure evil and a misundestood victim who need to be saved.

Sukuna as well most JJK villains are pretty straighfoward in terms of being villains without lack atributes that makes them complex characters, something that MHA certainly lacks as Horikoshi has a problem to give his villains a victim conplex while makes the comically evil at the same time.

And look I know both series have different narrative porpuses for their villains, but then again AFO is much more similar to JJK villains in most aspects. Yet like you said a big difference on why he's not as beloved as the rest of the villains on his own series is simply because Horikoshi constantly downplays him in favor of Shigaraki for example.

It surely doesn't help that AFO isn't conventionally attractive for most of the series while Shigaraki certainly is, despite some people can joke about his look the reality is that he's drawn as attractive and this is reflected on how readers react to him.

If AFO looked like this for most of the series I'm sure the opinions about him would be much more inclined to he positive:

Is a shame Horikoshi dropped the ball so hard with AFO.

I have the feeling that he regreted get rid of him back in Kamino and later struggled to justify his return and glory moments. At the same time he can't fully commit to make AFO way to perfect because HK is still obsessed with Shigaraki for some reason.

There's no room for both villains obviously, and the one that should've stayed is AFO.

If Horikoshi made AFO the definitive villain from the very beginning without switch between him and Shigaraki every 5 minutes, and if AFO was always attractive and with more "aura" moments he would be equally loved as Sukuna?

Well who knows really, but in my opinion all these factors surely could have affected a lot of the public perception.

Same applies to other villains like Overhaul, who are more loved than AFO despite being equally evil as him but sadly Kai didn't last too much either so he's not as popular as Shigaraki who gets constant attention.

Hello, do you mind if I ask your opinion on this :

What do you think that made a villain/antagonist characters are loved by many people? Like, why do you think Sukuna (JJK) is more loved by fans compared to AFO or even Shigaraki (BNHA)?

Also, why do you think Bakugou (BNHA) & Gojo (JJK) are so well loved by the fans of both series?

And, I've read somewhere that "......if Gojo and Bakugou's characters were female (with the same personality) then they will be hated by many..." Do you agree?

P.s

I know you're anti Bakugou, sorry if it's made you uncomfortable to talk about character you dislike, I just love to read your writings.

There are many reasons as to why villains/antagonists are loved by many people, but if I had to sum it up I think that :

Compared to the protagonists, because the antagonists are already demonised and usually called out by the narrative, people tend to find the little redeeming qualities that antagonists have and exemplify it by a 1000 X almost babying the villains while doing the exact opposite to the heroes because the narrative treats the heroes the opposite.

However, when talking about why some antagonists like sukuna are liked a lot more than other antagonists such as AFO, there are a variety of such as :

Characteristics they may have. Sukuna by the jjk fandom is interpreted as someone who is actually intimidating, can be a bit funny but ultimately gets down to business and is seen as an actual threat unlike AFO who just becomes and is written terribly that he doesn't particularly add any tension or emotion into the story

Their goals. Sukuna wants power. He wants to be on top, and he is described as a force of nature that can't be controlled. Yes, in some certain circumstances, he and AFO are similar, but sukuna is able to convey his goals, and the overall development of them from beginning to end is just better than AFO especially with how connected he ends up being g to the jujitsu world.

Their narrative treatment. The way the narrative treats both AFO and sukuna is complete different and it's the way the narrative treats sukuna that makes sukuna more enjoyable and a better character as he for example, is given many opportunities to show case his destructive and malicious behaviour compared to AFO. In the series, AFO is a lot more like a parasite harming many factors of the writing, but this is quite the opposite to sukuna.

Essentially, I think this is the best way to explain the differences in sukuna and AFO and why sukuna is a lot more enjoyable to people and overall better written.

However, I would also like to add that, in general, people like villains a lot more if the said villains are attractive, have a sense of charisma + charm to them, and if the villain ends up being powerful. These criteria end up being checked by sukuna, and AFO kinda fails to meet them, taking in the general fandoms opinion.

As to why characters like bakugo and Gojo are really popular, I think the reasons for that are:

Attractiveness. People find these characters really attractive, and if you have ever been in a fandom, then you know the lengths people will go to, to protect a character who is good-looking. People will overlook the characters' flaws and even valid criticism just because a character is hot. (Like beauty privilege for characters is so insane that you have people trying to defend/justify mei mei because she is pretty)

They're cool/they're badass. Ultimately, characters like bakugo and gojo are really cool. You see, a lot of people cheer them on because they think that this very powerful character is strong and they're someone who they kinda aspire to be as in that person is incredibly influential, they're strong, they're badass etc.

People think they're well written. Characters being well written is a subjective opinion personally I think gojo is a well written character but I don't think bakugo is a well written character. Ultimately, if a character is incredibly dynamic within the series they tend to change and get more moments that makes the audience connect with them.

Now with the statement below I kinda have mixed opinions on it.

Yes, misoginor in fandoms is a big problem that affects the interpretation of characters, and yes, it's been established that people tend to treat female characters a lot more harshly than male characters. Due to this, we got the whole you can't handle complex female characters trend. However, as time passes, I do like to believe that misoginor and racism in fandoms are problems that are becoming more recognised and that more and more people are starting to actually understand characters without being racist or misogynistic.

However, I understand that this is a very idealistic and optimistic view so I will say that if bakugo and gojo were to be female characters with the same personality you would probably have SOME people hate them due to misoginor.

But alas, I think that they wouldn't be as hated and would still be popular. I mean, in MHA, we literally have miriko, who is liked by many fans, and she, in my opinion, is very similar to bakugo.

(Gojo, on the other hand, might be a bit more complicated case)

Before ending this, I wanna say that there seems to be certain character flaws that people like or hate more if a character has them.

For example, there are certain character traits that make people hate characters no matter if they're protagonists or antagonsit or in between. These characteristics are :

Naivety

Ignorance

Hypocrisy

"Crybaby" characters

Cowards

I will say that these characteristics are things that people really hate in a character, and the fandom tends to hate characters that portray these characteristics at first. However, as you can see from the characters I have listed below, the fandom does slowly warm up to them after a while.

Essentially, I can understand why people may hate characters with these traits, especially when the world they're in is built to jarringly contrast the characteristics they have, making them seem annoying to the viewers. However, they are needed to add a huge layer of complexity to the series a lot of the time.

Of course, he doesn't mind go to public places like malls and buy stuff he likes like manga, nice clothes or little ornaments (I bet he got a collection of keychains).

He probably would also like arcades and play with friends and gf (Midoriya), try new restaurants, among other stuff you can do in the mall.

Cider pulled a better Vader inspired look than Kylo Ren funnily enough.

There's a big different between being confident and being narcissist. Cider really fits in the category of having confidence but in a good way, not even excessive confidence. He's also confident enough to tell a girl he meet how pretty she looks without making it sound like a creep or a weirdo, just a nice compliment.

So chapter 1 is already beta, and now my beta reader is helping me with chapter 2. This weekend will post the fic

I have a question...What you think Cinder does when he´s on, hum, let´s say off days?

Cool, I'm excited to read the final version.

So about Cider hobbies, I did mention some times that he's a surfer but that doesn't limit to the sea. After all he uses his quirk to surf in land as well.

Can we call his activity urban surfing? Pretty sure he's one of the few people who can pull off such sport lol.

I can imagine him going with his friends or solo to a derelic industrial complex or a scenario like that, a place with a lot of obstacles were practice his style for fun and training at the same time.

He's also a very good graffiti artist who likes to leave his own mark in a lot of places. Very standar for a gang to do so, but Cider likes a bit more of personality for his own graffiti.

He probably has an artistic side even if he doesn't realize that. And most likely Cider is the kind of guy who consume mangas more because of the pretty art than the story itself lol.

Midoriya probably was surprised they share a common interest on some geek stuff. I can see them having lazy days of just chill and cuddling, both reading mangas of different genres with some music in the background and making comments here and there about the story and characters.

Never read that story, but there's the movie "I Spit On Your Grave" which is basically glorification of revenge from a woman perspective. Or also arguably Shinobu story is also a revenge that the narrative puts in a good light, despite Shinobu has her problems.

Anyways I get the point you tried to make there.

Would be funny if all that bad marketing for U.A cause many parents to take their kids out of that school. Well at least if the parents are smarter in this AU than they're in canon (cause after so many assesination attemps how nobody question why they still send their childrens to a death trap?).

Mizunami would get hooked into Izu the first second he sees her, but a slow burn will be fun to read and see how the sexual tension between them growns.

He can totally take Compress, since he's not really anything special in terms in fight skills and as far we know he can't compress non solid objects, so a water user would ironically be a big problem especially since Cider is a medium to long range fighter. The fight would be quite easy to Muzunami, who will also hate the annoying "magician" act of Compress.

I really don't care about Momo, so whatever happens to her is fine for me.

His line "I'm a man who lives for the thrill" lives in my mind now. Rent free. He is a bold but smart man.

I was wondering...what it he goes to steal smth in UA? Not sure on what he could steal but hey why not? That would be a huge blow to their egos.

Plot twist. Izumi beats him first and she is the one to invade UA and stole SMTH - it was crucial for her plans- BK tried to downplayed so hard but hates how everyone is impressed.

No idea of what he would steal, but if he and Izu converge the same day with the same plan of steal some shit and they're like "wtf are you doing here?".

They almost start fighting but then Bakugou appears and tries to capture them screaming "Die!" as usual, but then Izu and Cider join forces and humilliate BK in public in the U.A grounds. A hard hit for his ego.

That would be also a moment for fall into a spiral of love and horniness for our thiefs.

Hey, would you mind telling me where you found the extras for the Rising villains? :)

The MHA wiki has good scans of the volume pages in each character article.

Hope it was useful!

I know! Nine in general would be an awesome villain for the main story, I'll die on that hill.

At the same time if AFO actually had eyes and was able to see Nine directly, he would have ended up in a vault Lmao. No way our dear demon lord let the perfect Yoichi clone to escape.

Horikoshi actually likes to imply a lot the idea of AFO projecting his obsession with Yoichi in different persons, like Shigaraki for example (even if in this case the parallel doesn't work quite well as with Nine). Or in a lesser degree with Dabi too.

We have panels like this as well:

And of course Nine and Shigaraki share their own set of visual parallels, which for a story standpoint makes sense as they're both in the same line of numerical experiments (another subplot totally wasted btw).

In general it feels like all this details and parallels were part of a bigger storyline that was cut short in the end, never reaching it's full potential (Shigaraki doesn't interact with Yoichi either for example).

So anyway we were robbed of having a big and interesting subplot with all the members of the Shigaraki family. Is a shame because it feels like AFO could have been a much more fully fleshed character.

MHA fans shouldn't ignore how beautiful Nine is.

Have you seen how gorgeous this man looks?

He should be bring into conversations about the most pretty male character more often.

Especially when Horikoshi draws him.

I don't think this need more explanation, Nine is something else.

Blame Horikoshi for not keeping Cider as a more recurring character! Is hard to get a big fandom when you only appear twice in the whole manga... despite TikTok seems to love Cider.

...

Can you describe how exactly Izumi scars look? Cause right now I imagine her looking like Maki from JJK in terms of scar tissue (and in the sense the scars are an aesthetic).

Of course Mizunami would love every single scar in Izumi, and probably think that makes her more perfect and autentic than any other woman.

I imagine a scene when she opens about her insecurities about her body to Mizunami, and she probably wears a lot of layers of clothes first to cover as much scar tissue as possible.

Instead of giving a verbal response, Mizunami starts taking off his own clothes (and Izu gets a bit shocked an embarrased for obvious reasons) and when he finally takes off his shirt Izu understands what he wanted to show.

Mizu's torso is also covered by years of all kind of scars product of being the member of a gang who got in constant fight with other villains, heroes or the police. He got a lot of cut scars, burns and even bullet scars.

But that doesn't matter to him and he tells Izumi with a lot of confidence that scars are cool and the most real proof of how badass they can be.

That would be the moment in which Mizunami gets into Izumi's heart, and she probably hugs him totally red and dizzy (because after all Cider is shirtless and she probably is getting her face pressed into his pecs). A cute moment of intimancy.

Can't stop thinking about a CiderDeku focused AU in which our favorite seltzer boy and Midoriya work as part time vigilantes together.

And since Izuku has a fire bending quirk in this AU, the contrast of his quirk and Cider's (who is named Mizunami Himura in this story) make people start calling them "Steam-Bow couple" as their unofficial vigilantes name.

Still thinking about the details of how they started their crusade together as vigilantes, but I like that idea I mention in other post about Mizunami saving Izuku from Bakugou when both of them still were in Aldera and Midoriya was around 13. Mizunami still was the leader of the Cider House gang (and maybe two years older than Midoriya) but later he left the group because he felt his members started to be way too problematic and getting in worse situations with civilians and heroes, something he didn't like because while Mizunami commited crimes like robbery he never tried to harm innocent people during his operations.

Besides he started feeling for Izuku after protect him from Bakugou, and since Izu wanted to stay with him after the incident they both start to get along and quickly became good friends, Mizu also helping Izu no being so shy and insecure about himself due the years of bullying.

He start helping Izuku to train his quirk and body during his free time, which served a lot for Midoriya to get in good shape and develop a fight style for the years to come as he still intented to apply to at least a low-middle tier hero school (and this will became important later).

I like to think the incident with the Sludge monster from chapter 1 was what caused a twist on their relationship, as unlike what happens in canon here when both of them are attacked by the Slime that escaped from A.M, Izuku and Mizunami give the monster a big surprise because they were able to fight back.

Slime turned to be quite vulnerable to water and fire combined, which allowed Izu and Mizu to restrain him in a bottle of soda and left him for the heroes finish the job later, as they run totally excited by the experience.

After escape and being safe, Izuku suddenly jump to the arms of Mizunami and they started kissing out of the excitement of the moment. When they calm down both smiled and since that moment they became officially boyfriends, and decide they would have more moments like this in the future so they will start fight criminals together.

Also the incident also give Izuku the final confidence boost he always needed and when Bakugou provoked him after school trying to make fun of Mizunami who was there for walk along Izuku to his home, Midoriya decided he had enough when Katsuki insulted his boyfriend.

So what happened next is that Izuku deep breath and expelled a big green fire ball from his mouth, which resulted in Bakugou getting a lot of first degree burns and loosing his eyebrows (something for what he would be mocked a lot later).

Mizunami used his water quirk to extinguish the fire over Bakugo's clothes who is totally terrified, then Mizu and Izuku laugh at him take a picture with their funs for future reference and run away together.

Hi @nyc3

CinderIzu is great and Cinder as a character was ignored, slept on ...bc villain stans are predictable into hot villains like dabi and shig(yes, shig is hot even in his possum way) and ...damn this fandom waste a good opportunity for a ship.

For a moment, thought you were talking about my idea.

I do like the idea Izumi being considered so beautiful even with her scars (she is prettier bc of her scars bc this woman survived) so in a country where the woman's value depends on her beauty...Izumi carrying her scars and being hot is amazing. Cinder would be into!

Cinder would also be into kill bk!

Her entire story, as she describes what BK did, seems like SA. See? The difference of boy and girl here is how people perceive the violence.

But I'm into this ship.

I do like sgdk a lot.

I do like dabideku too

But CinderIzu??? I'm open and so far like the ideas.

I know!

That's a double edge sword because while having such great looking characters makes the world of MHA more interesting, it also makes us wish more of them have more screen time despite it's quite impossible.

I need to think on a spinoff with Cider as the main character btw...

You can't imagine how much I love the Cider House leader guy...

A minor villain has no right to look so cool, badass and handsome like he does.

Also he probably got the best water quirk of the series.

Also he got so much sassy energy on top of having such insane drip.

Being one of his like 3 fans isn't easy, but still love him.

A detail people tend to overlook (cause the anime fucked up the timeline) is that Geten and Cider were introduced in the same chapter in the manga.

And Re-Destro speech juxtaposed with Cider presentation.

So we have this two boys of a similar age, both have water/ice based quirks, both have white/blue-ish hair, both have the same blue eyes, and we didn't know their real identity at first (and in Geten's case is debatable if that's his real name).

What a big coincide huh?

My theory of C.H leader being a lost Himura gets more and more crazy everytime I think about it.

I love the idea of Geten and Cider, who I call Mizunami Himura, being lost siblings. And by extensions the lost cousings of the Todorokis.

I haven't seen anyone commenting about something weird on how AFO is represented in the recent art by Horikoshi:

That being the fact this is the "prime" version of him with his face restored, but wearing the final war outfit and maskless. Something clearly not possible in the story itself, as obviously that outfit was gone when he used rewind on himself for avoid die by the fire of Endeavor.

But the interesting part is that this isn't the first time Horikoshi draw AFO in this particular way, mixing his restored look with the purple jacket outfit.

The other time was in that cover in which he's facing Deku (a battle that never happened in the story, or at least not directly against his main body).

In that other art AFO also has a unique look for his mask not being seen in the story, that looks vaguely like it was still broken and almost melted by Endeavor but pieced together again while still being red hot.

Also do you notice in neither of those arts AFO has the rewind effects over him? Considering it was the plot reason he recovered his face in the first place, is a bit weird that the art of Horikoshi doesn't present him being under rewind.

And yeah I know all this can be attributed to simple creative freedom and Horikoshi though mix both designs was cool or something.

But I can't help and make my theories about this.

Can these arts be a sort of "what if" scenario?

As I said before is interesting to remember that Deku never actually fight against AFO directly on his real body, they never even encouter each other in that state for that matter, they only interacted via ShigAFO.

So maybe Horikoshi at some point had a totally different display for the final battle? One that involved Deku vs AFO and a different use of rewind.

Considering in both arts "prime" AFO appears maskless with his outfit intact, I wonder if the real revelation moment when the heroes managed to destroy his new mask wasn't seeing his potato face, but he already got his face restored offscreen.

Which could also explain why Horikoshi didn't drawn AFO with the rewind effects in the art. As probably the idea of him being on a time counter that will banish him wasn't originally part of the story and only was a leter addition.

So in this alternative scenario rather than go back to fight ShigAFO directly, Deku instead for some reason ends up in front of the original AFO and they have a real battle, just as it was represented in the cover art.

Don't know how the story should continue from that point, as it probably would change a lot more of how the rest of the final battle will play.