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Wanna Be Twisted - TryHardNinja

Happy Dragon Year! by Lor Baa (Kelvin Law)

it's all in the eyes

objects in art: swords/daggers

(This is gonna be a long analysis)

I love angbang soooooo much. So much that I looked into all the religious subtext that their relationship is full of. Someone help me...................I mean it’s hard to separate the cannon from it’s religious connotations.........I needed to know all I could about angbang so here goes:

Okay I think Sauron and Melkor’s relationship was supposed to be an illustration of Idolatry.

The way Tolkien talks about their relationship seems to back this up.

On one hand he says: “but there was seen an effect of Melkor on Sauron: he spoke of Melkor in Melkor’s own terms: as a god, or even as god. This may have been a residue of a state which was in a sense a shadow of good: the ability once in Sauron to at least admire or admit the superiority of a being other than himself.”

And:

“While Morgoth still stood, Sauron did not seek his own supremacy, but worked and schemed for another, desiring the triumph of Melkor, whom in the begining he had adored.”

Now to put plainly it seems Sauron worshipped Melkor. He thought of him as god, and at least in the beginning adored him. He did not desire his own triumph, but the triumph of Melkor. He worked and schemed for him, for someone he admired and adored, for someone he seemed to revere.

It should be noted that the word “adore” is used to describe the way the valar and elves feel towards Eru. This makes it seem that Marion worships Melkor in the way the valar/elves worship Eru. That this feeling is good and “holy”

(I believe the word admire is also used in the same way)

But of course we are talking about dark lords, and Tolkien has admitted his stories are religious works. Naturally Sauron’s feelings for Melkor cannot from a religious lens be viewed as on the same level with worship and admiration of Eru.

This is displayed when Tolkien expresses only Eru can give TRUE love and independence. He also states that no sub-creator can give love in that same way, and that it is a wish for loving obedience. Then it is stated that can only turn into robotic servitude, which is inherently evil.

Now this is most likely a jab at Sauron, but it is NOT invalidating the strength of his original worship and devotion. It seems to be implying that as Tolkien said: “This may have been a residue of a state which was in a sense a shadow of good: the ability once in Sauron to at least admire or admit the superiority of a being other than himself.”

And that: “(he worked)desiring the triumph of Melkor, whom in the begining he had adored.”

(Again the words adored and admired again. Those in themselves were considered holy and devout feelings, things pure and selfless. Given to an idol they in the eyes of Eru become corrupt.)

Now it seems Mairon’s admiration and worship of Melkor was in essence the same in feeling as those who worshiped Eru, (they both feel admiration and reverence) but is inherently unholy and sinful. Something to be abhorred in its denial of god.

Or it could be that Sauron’s clear admiration for Melkor was a shadow of the gift Eru had given him, one that turned into sin as time went on. It was a shadow goodness and selflessness, but became corrupt.

Either way there are clear parallels between Sauron’s worship of Morgoth and Idolatry. Apparently just because you worship someone it doesn’t mean it’s holy. Sauron gave himself up, became imbued with evil and corruption, but his worship towards Melkor ran deep and kept him loyal for a long time. He denied Eru, but as Tolkien said in his words: “(Sauron)wasn’t a true atheist” as he instead looked to Melkor. But in worshipping Melkor he denied Eru.

Now Tolkien does seem to imply Sauron’s original feelings for Melkor were valid and pure, that is until they turned into denial of the true god and his love. Then of course Sauron’s feelings must have diminished into a shell of all true and holy love. Something with only semblance of such a “holy” thing as love for god.

SIGH.....Tolkien how come I had to raised by theologians to understand this reference. I never liked theology but of course my parents taught me to read Middle-English.

So what we can garner from this is it seems Sauron’s original love/devotion to Melkor was true and valid, but then became corrupted and twisted when it turned into denial of Eru. It became a shell of true love, something that caused him to remain in loyal and constant service to Morgoth through the millennia.

OR we can just focus on how it was all written from an unreliable narrator and thus we can do what we want!

Plus why does Sauron’s love of Melkor have to be inherently unholy! Why is love in itself not a pure and selfless action?

Tolkien made clear Sauron schemed for Melkor, desired the triumph of Melkor during all the time he served him. Even if his love was only holy in the beginning he still remained constantly selflessly devoted to Melkor, even when it contradicted his own goal. It would have been obvious to Sauron Melkor wished to destroy, while Sauron himself wished to innovate and control. You cannot innovate out of nothingness. But he still worked for Melkor, desired Melkor’s success and was implementing Melkor’s plans. What about that besides who it’s given to in unholy in any way?

Now there is the argument that a big part of his service to Morgoth was based of if his desire for power. Now as much as it might seem that was true from how he is described being drawn to Melkor’s strength, the fact that Tolkien said he did not seek his own supremacy, but desired the success of Melkor, and worked and schemed FOR someone other than himself, I do not think it could ever be reduced to simply that.

He seemed close to selfless in his actions as he was scheming and giving himself up for someone else.

I disagree with Tolkien. I believe reverence in itself is good and true. I believe to adore, to be selfless is good and true, though of course it is no excuse for committing evil. I just mean to me Sauron retained something good, even amidst the cocoon of his evil. So I guess I choose to interpret this in a different way, I choose to see his devotion not as inherent sin but as a fragment of good within him, which is almost what Tolkien meant honestly

But like it’s still love. He is working and scheming and striving for the success of someone other than himself. Tolkien said he desired Melkor’s success, and that his feelings for Melkor were the shadow of good. He is selfless in the fact he is truly desiring the goal of someone else above himself, and he is acting on it.

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Hi! I'm a bit confused by DreamXD's origin...so if you don't mind me asking, is DreamXD not he same as Dreamon? And was that not created for a demon/possessed arc involving Tubbo and Fundy? I know about the George/DreamXD lore stream but I don't really see how DreamXD's origin relates to George?

Oh, anon, oh lovely anon, hello, you have no idea how much serotonin this ask gives me-oh how I love xdnf. Just for an update on DreamXD, I would highly recommend watching these three streams because they're the ones that let us understand DreamXD's character the most, but if you want a more quick analysis, continue reading. 

Long story short my theory is that, and with peace and love it's been months so I might forget some things, think of DreamXD and the Dreamon as the angel and devil on c!Dream’s shoulders but he also has some of their power - remember that c!Dream can bring back people from the dead from a book he got somewhere - because maybe c!Dream sold his soul to the “devil” then when c!Fundy and c!Tubbo did the Dreamon ritual on c!Dream the theory is that pulled the Dreamon out of c!Dream and that angered the Dreamon that was pretty chill but now is manipulating other characters (including c!Dream? perhaps?) but also the Dreamon and DreamXD are separate characters in the same body that push each other around for dominance and DreamXD and c!Dream can’t remember when the Dreamon takes over their bodies. If that doesn’t make sense to you, sorry, we haven’t gotten much background and that’s mainly just my mind a-theorizing. 

But most of all what you must understand is DreamXD, the God of the server, the protector, with a Dreamon side for the flavor 🤙 is a simp for c!George (as all the "Dreamverse" characters are hmm-). 

DreamXD’s lore is intertwined with c!George because George was the first on the server and DreamXD fell in love with these little mushroom guy that was kind to animals and poured water over trees that were on fire and was sweet to all the people on his server and DreamXD loved George because George is love. And DreamXD saw George and his best friend c!Dream have fun and exploring the world together and he saw George become king and Dream as his loyal knight and he saw c!Dream going down the wrong path and winding up in prison and he saw how this hurt George and saw how he missed Dream so much and so DreamXD made himself into the best visual replica that he could of George’s friend Dream and he comes to George in a dream and he sees the light in George’s eyes and the smile on his face again. But then George realizes DreamXD’s powers creative mode and George wants this power, he wants Dream back he wants strength but as you saw in the video above, that comes with a price and the price is being DreamXD’s friend forever. It’s an easy price for George, because it’s Dream DreamXD.  

But are the Dreamon and DreamXD the same person? The thing is I think yes. I think DreamXD is a god with a temper. He’s layered. I think the Dreamon side - shows himself to everyone, because as we saw in the DreamXD stream DreamXD kept running up to people and say he was going to eat their souls, etc. so George had to teach him how to be “human” - and the DreamXD side only speaks to George - because he has a “welcoming presence”, because he was the first on the server, because DreamXD loves George because George is love. Notice how when George says DreamXD is scaring him, the Dreamon disappears and DreamXD shows up because he doesn’t want to scare George, George is love and all DreamXD wants is his acceptance, his love, his “friendship” and in return DreamXD offers him a friend, a protector, someone who’s there for him the way Dream always was. 

I do think about how Tommy's fanon design kept the green handkerchief, while Tubbo very rarely has his post-New L'manberg. And how often people see Tubbo in Tommy's shadow, when upon Tommy's death, Tubbo had his husband and child and his country, when at the thought of losing Tubbo, Tommy couldn't imagine who he'd be without him. Exile for Tubbo meant all of NLM with no Tommy, exile for Tommy meant no one at all, and a chest full of photos of Tubbo. "I feel like I always saw you as a sort of sidekick" and Tommy kept his handkerchief and Tubbo lost his compass