Ok So For Everyone Here Saying Dune Is A White Savior Story, I'm Gonna Need You To Understand That Paul

Ok so for everyone here saying dune is a white savior story, i'm gonna need you to understand that paul doesn't save anyone here. He just takes the fremen from a forced opression into a willing one, by shackling them with his own made up religion.

He's still a tragic figure, because he doesn't really want this but he knows that this is the only path in which he still has some amount of control on the bloody space crusade led by his worshippers. Every other path has the same result but worse. So he tries to fight that "terrible purpose" every step of the way until he reaches the breaking point, his son (sir Not-appearing-in-this-film) dies and he just goes "fuck it, this is gonna happen anyways, might as well just commit to it" and ends up being responsible for the deaths of like 60 billion ppl. But he isnt a white savior here.

Spoilers for dune messiah :

In the sequel, its made pretty obvious that the space jihad sucked ass for everyone. No one in the galaxy likes the imperium, the fremen who came back are maimed, old cynical veterans who fucking hate paul for having sent them on a meaningless crusade across the universe, and paul himself has grown from a young idealist forced to bear the burden of prescience into a bitter, cynical and jaded old man who cant be bothered to give two shits about anything but his rapidly deteriorating interpersonal relationships with the ppl around him. Thats the tragedy part. Thats the part where you look at the full picture and you're like "well thats sad, he was such a nice little kid at first."

As for the "white savior", if the whole "everything has gone to shit" wasnt enough to convince you thats not the case, paul literally has a scene whe he just looks at the reader and says "i am literally worse than h*tler" and stilgar unironically responds "well yeah i mean his k/d ratio was kinda shit tbh my lord"

correct me if i’m wrong cos i don’t watch dune.. but i’ve seen people call paul a tragic character. except isn’t he a whole white coloniser tricking indigenous poc into believing he’s a prophet to serve his own interests? that’s inherently evil that cannot be a tragic character imo

so yes that is correct that is what happens. the tragedy is that he is a sixteen year old boy who gets a vision of this happening and he is TERRIFIED and absolutely does not want this to happen at all. He does not want the holy war he does not want to be the chosen one he initially very much wants to fight alongside the fremen as equals trying to liberate themselves from their current colonizer without becoming the messiah because they have common political cause.

And then the entire second half of the first book (and the second movie) are about the concessions he makes to himself bit by bit by bit (well it’s the only way to save his mom and sister. well it’s the only way to prevent nuclear war. well he does want his revenge. well maybe he IS special.) Until by the end he has lost 100% of his humanity, fully wants to be the messiah and is willing to manipulate people into thinking so, and has declared himself duke of arrakis in his father’s name and made a play for the imperial throne.

you’re right that it’s evil. the book and these movies agree with you. the tragedy is watching a child who desperately wanted to avoid this slowly completely lose himself to it anyways. i don’t think “tragic” and “evil” are inherently mutually exclusive.

More Posts from Feukt-42 and Others

1 month ago

Man, I almost drank myself to death yesterday, I can't even remember my name, if only there was someone that could help me.

The the trustworthy and saint-like lieutenant:

Man, I Almost Drank Myself To Death Yesterday, I Can't Even Remember My Name, If Only There Was Someone
1 month ago

WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU MEAN WE COULD HHAVRE HAD A CUNO ANDF CUNOESSE FOCUSED DISCO ELMYSIUM SPINOFF I WXANT LOCUST CITY INJECTED INTO MY VEINS RIGHT FUCKING NOW


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3 months ago

Fun fact about Emma's fighting style : she has one of, if not the cleanest looking renditions of the Ashina cross anyone ever performs in-game.

Sekiro and the Ashina elites that can do it only relly do the bare minimum that could theoretically be called an Ashina cross : the movement is somewhat there but the two arcs are almost parallel.

Isshin, who has either invented or mastered the technique, has a much cleaner looking version. Where Sekiro and the elites' versions looked like two nondescript slashes, Isshin's actually looks like a cross. But even still, there is a fairly noticeable obtuse/acute angle.

Meanwhile, if we look at Emma's version, it's an almost perfect cross. I'm talking like 75 degrees angle, that shit is almost perpendicular. It is, without a doubt, the most cross like of any rendition performed in the game . And honestly, it's kinda fitting she'd know that move so well.

After all, Isshin does boast it is fast enough to sever a shura's arm...

I need a moment to yell about what a tragic and interesting character Emma is.

Yes, she's been placed in a stereotypically female role as the healer and the guide for the male protagonist. She's a doctor, a caregiver, yes, but there is so much more to her. She is integral to so much of the heartbreak in this story and not because she isn't trying. She just can't escape it.

She's not a fighter, but she has a sword, and the reason she learned how to use it is specifically because she is waiting for a man who means the world to her to turn into a demon so she can kill him.

The Sculptor rescued her from a battlefield when she was a small child and starving. He helped raise her and eventually placed her in Dogen's care.

She visits him often, she asks for his advice on some really difficult, delicate matters.

This is her father in all the ways that matter (and he's actually a good father compared to some other fathers in this story). She clearly respects and loves him.

And she also knows that he is turning into a demon and the only thing she can do about it is make sure she is ready to kill him when the time comes.

Her relationship with Isshin is also tied up in this. Isshin is her lord. He is also her teacher, since he is the one who trained her in swordsmanship.

Isshin's skill with the sword is so fabled they call him the Sword Saint. This guy lives to swordfight. His greatest achievement (according to him) isn't killing a tyrant and freeing his country, it's developing his own fighting style and never stopped trying to improve it (and handing out pamphlets about it).

That's the guy Emma got to train her.

Isshin got a tutor to train his beloved grandson (as is proper), but he trained Emma himself and it doesn't come as a surprise once you learn that Isshin was the one who stopped the Sculptor from turning into Shura before.

Emma must have told him.

Imagine Emma asking Isshin to train her in swordsmanship. Isshin, who fought Shura and lived, must have looked at this small, waifish woman and asked her why. And then he ended up teaching her anyway.

Specifically so she can kill a demon.

(And the beautiful thing about this, in terms of Sekiro being a video game, is that this is not just something we're informed of, but it's reflected in the actual gameplay. If you end up fighting her, Emma's moveset is a slimmed down, slightly less reactive version of Grandpa Isshin's. She has the same perilous attacks (including the same grab), she has Ashina cross, she does that little slash if you stick too close.

Conversely, Genichiro, despite being Isshin's heir, fights nothing like his grandfather. Because he was taught by Tomoe. Actually, the way fighting styles are used for characterisation is another thing that has me raving about this game. Like the fact that Owl is the only enemy in the entire game who can perform a Mikiri counter...).

However, Isshin isn't just her lord and her teacher. He also dresses up as a mythological figure to hunt down spies and those of his grandson's allies he doesn't approve of in his castle. Emma knows this. Isshin knows Emma knows this and she gets away with teasing her about it. They have a cute, friendly relationship.

But more importantly, Isshin is also her patient and they both know he's dying.

There's this inevitableness about all of Emma's relationships. See also Genichiro: Emma and he were childhood friends. They used to hang out with Takeru and Tomoe by the sakura tree. If you share enough sake with her she'll tell you about how she used to sneak out of the castle to watch Genichiro pratice Tomoe's Lightning (and did Genichiro taking his shirt off when he does that move have anything to do with that?)

But she's spending enough time with Isshin to know that Genichiro's days, too, are numbered. And there's that sad memory in which she tells Kuro about the sediment and how people who use it lose their humanity bit by bit.

Oh, and since I mentioned Tomoe ... if you pursue the Purification route, you find out that Emma saw Tomoe attempt Purification (which only failed because she didn't have the Mortal Blade). Emma saw Tomoe, presumably her friend, attempt suicide. To spare Takeru.

And then there's Wolf and Kuro. Who not only act as a catalyst for the Genichiro situation to finally turn to shit. She also soon realises that Wolf and Kuro find themselves in the same bind as Takeru and Tomoe.

And with the knowledge that at least one of them has to die, one of them a small child, she chooses to let the child die and save the man. Witholding the information on how to attempt Purification is one of very few choices Emma actually gets to make in this story. Everything else is ripped from her control (Sculptor's condition, Isshin's condition, Genichiro's condition, the situation the entire country is in). And it's such an interesting choice to make for her.

There's this child, who is convinced that the only way to end the curse of immortality is for him to have his head cut off with a magic sword. And her choice is whether or not to tell the depressed Shinobi looking after this boy that there's an option for the child to live but it requires the Shinobi to cut his own head off instead.

And she chooses to say nothing.

She's making her decision and in doing so, she's effectively taking the choice away from Wolf. And it eventually leads to even more heartbreak, because if you actually make Wolf kill Kuro, Wolf is miserable for the rest of his days, taking the place of the Sculptor and set to eventually turn into a demon himself.

And that's so interesting.

And every day I'm cursing the gaming gods because Fromsoft hasn't made more story games like this.

Break my heart again, I can take it.


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9 months ago

Do you guys get me or am i reaching way too far rn

Do You Guys Get Me Or Am I Reaching Way Too Far Rn

Alia Atreides written in the style of Disco Elysium with the skills being represented by her ancestors in Other Memory, hit post


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4 months ago

When you show up to the clinic to get a new blood vial after killing Gascoigne and Iosefka's voice sounds different

When You Show Up To The Clinic To Get A New Blood Vial After Killing Gascoigne And Iosefka's Voice Sounds

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5 months ago

Been a while since i read fma but this was basically how chap. 62 went right ?

Been A While Since I Read Fma But This Was Basically How Chap. 62 Went Right ?

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7 months ago

Also interesting to note, the minor erdtree incantation specifically separates acts of affection and care from order. Marika's attempts to heal her people are classified as "the kindness of gold, without order", implying kindness, and love, are absent from order entirely.

If chaos is entwined with love, it would only make sense for order, its antithesis, to be divorced from it.

The fact that all of the lords of frenzy became the lords of frenzy for love.

Vyke sought out the three fingers because he didn’t want his maiden to burn.

Shabriri uses our love for Melina as a reason to become the lord of frenzy so that Melina doesn’t have to burn.

We don’t know that exact circumstances with how or why Midra inherited the flame, but he loved Nanaya enough to endure the madness and asks for her forgiveness before he becomes the lord of the frenzied flame.

But also Melina uses the fact that life endures despite hardship, which means that love endures as well, as a reason to not inherit the flame of frenzy.

Chaos and love are entwined with each other.

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feukt-42 - Rambles and shitposts i guess :l
Rambles and shitposts i guess :l

hi there i dont really have anything to say im just kinda here

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