P5 Royal - Blog Posts

Makoto trying to get to know Ann

Makoto: So...what type of guys do you like?

Ann: I like girls.

Makoto: Oh thank god, me too.

🃏

1/2

Yusuke Fanart

Sumire/Futaba

Makoto & Haru!

Shuake

Turretangel spamming my asks>>>

Hahaha I would never do that ( @checkerstheboard @avendoki @turretangel What character do I remind you guys of? 😊)

my friends open drawing requests and i bow my head with shame and avoid eye contact as i ask for the character they Already Knew I Would Ask For

if the version of akechi in the third semester is just Joker's 'ideal' version of him (rather than the og akechi actually being alive) then that implies he likes akechi crazy. He saw akechi's reveal as a complete maniac and thought that was cool.

Akechi comes back in maruki's world just as insane and angry as he was in the engine room and joker LIKES that.

Hey, so I don't want to be that guy, but when are we going to acknowledge that Akechi was right?

No, I obviously don't mean about the things he was very clearly wrong about. I'm referring to the things he says in interviews about the Phantom Thieves. I hate how many people switch up after playing through his betrayal who previously agreed with his views, because nothing he said is wrong and nothing he did changes that fact. He speaks in the TV Station on the objective facts that he should know about, and with or without the context of his form of justice those facts stay true. It's a fallacy to claim that his form of justice being universally less approved of makes the Phantom Thieves better by comparison, or discredits anything he said. I don't think the Phantom Thieves are evil, or that they should necessarily be imprisoned, but I do think that they are not morally sound. They're kids. Prior to his betrayal I think he served his purpose well, but it's easy to disregard the validity of his words when you find out that he's a murderer. With the knowledge he SHOULD have had (and that many DID have), everything he says is true. And honestly? It still can be true for basically the entire plot of the game. Mishima's confidant tests the thieves in that way. They could have changed the hearts of anyone who's not a persona user, for any personal reason. It's a slippery slope.

I'll use these three options as an example for why he's right:

"They're justice itself" is just subjective and incorrect, because justice as a concept is individualized and given how each Phantom Thief has different reasons for being one it's ridiculous for even them to say. Their first target was before they even formed a group, and Ann was ready to kill Kamoshida. The others were not even going to step in, and they were going to respect her choice either way. All the members are so different, so this is an insane claim to make.

"They're necessary" is wrong because to say they are necessary is pretty disingenuous to all "justice" that has ever happened BEFORE they existed. I don't believe that the Thieves were a necessity per say, and personally I think their actions can only be judged on a case by case basis. Some Mementos targets for example have issues that stem beyond what they have done. Now they have their desires stolen but still have the issue that pushed them to immortality in the first place, plus a shitton of guilty baggage. The Thieves only help with the atonement, but not the push. How many of those people didn't just go right back to their past behaviors? How many of them got worse in other ways? Think about Futaba, she felt so guilty for something she thought she did, she formed a palace to condemn herself to die alone. To claim the Thieves are necessary to reform society implies that their method is the most effective, and I think that's a lot to claim for something they don't understand.

"They do more than the cops" I almost agree with. Legally the police in Japan in this game anyway (yes I'm aware it extends to reality in many ways, but I'm referring to just the game right now) are corrupt and flawed for the most part, but the thing I don't agree with is that this makes the Thieves a better alternative. They're not. For the same reason Yoshizawa says later, the Thieves can only do so much as vigilantes, and to imply that society should rely on these faceless nameless flawed people to fix society is not any better than what they have now. Especially with the method being unknown, potentially unsafe, and easily exploitable. I cannot be the only one who if the Phantom Thieves were real, would be extremely alarmed by the prospect of a group of vigilantes "changing hearts" right? It's so vague, and the pattern is dystopian. At least police methods are familiar

What I'm saying is that they're kids, and it's kind of insane that this game places Akechi as the narrative foil for the Thieves in their message and then makes it so easy to disregard because "he's an assassin so how could he know anything about justice". The Thieves don't either, and Ann was nearly a murderer. If the bar is "don't commit murder when you're infiltrating someone's mind" then it's far too low. I wouldn't trust a group of adults with this power to reform society, even less a group of teenage vigilantes. I'm 19, and I find this odd. And Strikers frames them as even more righteous, and it bugs me even more in that game. At least Royal has the third semester to give a bit more nuance to how big of a responsibility Ren was given, but that's also very frequently misinterpreted.

I love this game, and I love this fandom, and I have thoughts that get weird and ranty. I apologize, but I hope you all found this as interesting as I did.

Hey, so I don't want to be that guy, but when are we going to acknowledge that Akechi was right?

No, I obviously don't mean about the things he was very clearly wrong about. I'm referring to the things he says in interviews about the Phantom Thieves. I hate how many people switch up after playing through his betrayal who previously agreed with his views, because nothing he said is wrong and nothing he did changes that fact. He speaks in the TV Station on the objective facts that he should know about, and with or without the context of his form of justice those facts stay true. It's a fallacy to claim that his form of justice being universally less approved of makes the Phantom Thieves better by comparison, or discredits anything he said. I don't think the Phantom Thieves are evil, or that they should necessarily be imprisoned, but I do think that they are not morally sound. They're kids. Prior to his betrayal I think he served his purpose well, but it's easy to disregard the validity of his words when you find out that he's a murderer. With the knowledge he SHOULD have had (and that many DID have), everything he says is true. And honestly? It still can be true for basically the entire plot of the game. Mishima's confidant tests the thieves in that way. They could have changed the hearts of anyone who's not a persona user, for any personal reason. It's a slippery slope.

I'll use these three options as an example for why he's right:

"They're justice itself" is just subjective and incorrect, because justice as a concept is individualized and given how each Phantom Thief has different reasons for being one it's ridiculous for even them to say. Their first target was before they even formed a group, and Ann was ready to kill Kamoshida. The others were not even going to step in, and they were going to respect her choice either way. All the members are so different, so this is an insane claim to make.

"They're necessary" is wrong because to say they are necessary is pretty disingenuous to all "justice" that has ever happened BEFORE they existed. I don't believe that the Thieves were a necessity per say, and personally I think their actions can only be judged on a case by case basis. Some Mementos targets for example have issues that stem beyond what they have done. Now they have their desires stolen but still have the issue that pushed them to immortality in the first place, plus a shitton of guilty baggage. The Thieves only help with the atonement, but not the push. How many of those people didn't just go right back to their past behaviors? How many of them got worse in other ways? Think about Futaba, she felt so guilty for something she thought she did, she formed a palace to condemn herself to die alone. To claim the Thieves are necessary to reform society implies that their method is the most effective, and I think that's a lot to claim for something they don't understand.

"They do more than the cops" I almost agree with. Legally the police in Japan in this game anyway (yes I'm aware it extends to reality in many ways, but I'm referring to just the game right now) are corrupt and flawed for the most part, but the thing I don't agree with is that this makes the Thieves a better alternative. They're not. For the same reason Yoshizawa says later, the Thieves can only do so much as vigilantes, and to imply that society should rely on these faceless nameless flawed people to fix society is not any better than what they have now. Especially with the method being unknown, potentially unsafe, and easily exploitable. I cannot be the only one who if the Phantom Thieves were real, would be extremely alarmed by the prospect of a group of vigilantes "changing hearts" right? It's so vague, and the pattern is dystopian. At least police methods are familiar

What I'm saying is that they're kids, and it's kind of insane that this game places Akechi as the narrative foil for the Thieves in their message and then makes it so easy to disregard because "he's an assassin so how could he know anything about justice". The Thieves don't either, and Ann was nearly a murderer. If the bar is "don't commit murder when you're infiltrating someone's mind" then it's far too low. I wouldn't trust a group of adults with this power to reform society, even less a group of teenage vigilantes. I'm 19, and I find this odd. And Strikers frames them as even more righteous, and it bugs me even more in that game. At least Royal has the third semester to give a bit more nuance to how big of a responsibility Ren was given, but that's also very frequently misinterpreted.

I love this game, and I love this fandom, and I have thoughts that get weird and ranty. I apologize, but I hope you all found this as interesting as I did.

Not to mention this bit.

Originally, I thought that the reason he made this mistake in the first place is because he didn't associate the voice with Morgana. But clearly Ryuji calls Morgana a cat AFTER the pancake lines, and Morgana responds, so Akechi is responding later to Morgana's dialogue when he SHOULD know it's from the cat. Obviously this doesn't necessarily mean that he registered that this specific cat was only talking because of Metaverse hijinks, but I think that's a very reasonable conclusion for him to come to. Cats aren't supposed to talk, and I think he's cautious and intelligent enough to know that talking to this one could give him away. He could have referenced that they discussed Down Town, because it was Ryuji who said that. But no, apparently the talking cat isn't suspicious enough to be wary of. What I'm saying is every time I see this scene, I realize new things that make it funnier and more ridiculous of a fumble to make.

For the record, I love him even when he's a bit dumb

Goro "Please invite me to have pancakes with you because I'm soooo hungry, so I can decline due to scheduling issues" Akechi, walking in on a conversation that will ruin his whole career.

It's so funny to me that he rushes out because he's busy, but not before very unsubtly suggesting that they invite him to Dome Town anyway. Sir???

Goro "Please invite me to have pancakes with you because I'm soooo hungry, so I can decline due to scheduling issues" Akechi, walking in on a conversation that will ruin his whole career.

It's so funny to me that he rushes out because he's busy, but not before very unsubtly suggesting that they invite him to Dome Town anyway. Sir???

Quick rant about Akiren, because I see many different interpretations of him (some I agree with, some I don't) but one that I don't see very often is this.

Yes, he loves his friends and cares for them. But imagine this- his home life was very uneventful, and considering how his family doesn't bother to reach out after his arrest, I'd imagine they see him as a lost cause. They gave up, or his worth is conditional. They love him conditionally. Being raised like that affects you as a person, and I like to imagine that after Igor told him that he now has to fill the role of a hero preventing ruin, and his bonds with people give him the strength he needs to do so, he embraces it. He embraces feeling important and valued, being admired, being the protagonist. Suddenly he has the world on his shoulders, and these people look up to him and admire and love him for it. Every dialogue response he chooses is his own thoughts, but he chooses what gives him more points. What people want to hear. He helps people so they look up to him, because he loves the attention and filling the role of the hero.

Especially since he's not very expressive, and he's nominated as the leader just because he fills the role the best. He embraces attention but he rejects vulnerability. It really feels like he cares for the image of a leader. It takes him a long time to see his role as anything other than the hero he loves being. I would say around Futaba's palace is when he starts to truly care for the Thieves, which is why by the Casino arc he chooses to protect their identities and risk his lives for them. He does eventually come to care for them, but he's supposed to be a leader. He's important suddenly. Playing the leader is selfish, but as the same time, as the leader he doesn't GET to be selfish. Playing the hero means he has to be empathetic, and that's where the selfishness lies. The intentions. Only once he risks his life for them does his true heroism shine. It's not about people relying on him, it's about him protecting them.

It's even better because after Futaba's palace when he fully starts to care, Morgana leaves and their decision to save Morgana is purely because they value their team. Morgana is his friend, so they must protect him. It's not a prerequisite of heroism to put aside their goals for Morgana.

And this interpretation makes 2/2 even more interesting, because he's given the opportunity to get the one thing he wished for. He can make the selfish choice. Doing so would give up not only his hero role, but also would betray and abandon everyone he cares about. 2/2 is like a checkpoint where he remembers how the Thieves formed and how at some point, his priorities shifted from being the protagonist and hero admired by all, to wanting to protect the people close to him. He has to reconcile with why. He has to think "It's not about me being selfish for once by taking Maruki's deal, it's about the fact that I care for these people and I don't want to hurt and betray them."

So yeah, I love this interpretation of Akiren Kurumiya and I would love to see more of this, please and thank you.

@checkerstheboard I love you very much and I'm very glad to have you as my fiance ❤️

Artists of Tumblr, where you at?

I love how Persona 5 solved the issue of train fares. If Ren doesn't have enough money on him to travel in crucial scenes, there's special dialogue where Morgana pipes up and basically calls Ren broke and pays the rest of the fee.

I just find it hilarious because this literally means that not only does your cat have his own savings, but if you don't have enough for the Kichijoji trip with Ryuji, then Makoto literally sees your cat pay your train fare while stalking you. Think about how embarrassing it is, to be so broke that your cat has to pitch in for your transportation.

I love how Persona 5 solved the issue of train fares. If Ren doesn't have enough money on him to travel in crucial scenes, there's special dialogue where Morgana pipes up and basically calls Ren broke and pays the rest of the fee.

I just find it hilarious because this literally means that not only does your cat have his own savings, but if you don't have enough for the Kichijoji trip with Ryuji, then Makoto literally sees your cat pay your train fare while stalking you. Think about how embarrassing it is, to be so broke that your cat has to pitch in for your transportation.

I want to add to this. I reblogged it before I actually thought of what I wanted to say, but it finally connected in my head. I agree with all of this, but it was mainly the realization that what the fandom calls his sudden "traumadumping", as funny as it is, is literally just him attempting to make Ren feel close to him without any real vulnerability.

He talks about his mom with Ren unprompted, and says he hasn't told anyone this before, and that's true- because he hates feeling pitied. He doesn't want to feel weak, but he does want to be cared for. He wants to be supported, by anyone, but most people would react to his hardship with sympathy that he doesn't need or believe he deserves or earns. So he instead opens up to Ren because he sees them on equal footing. They're on the same page, and he wants Ren to feel a connection to him even if it's entirely fabricated and calculated. It's partially due to habit because, y'know, Detective Prince mask requires him to do this already in general, but also because so much of his real hardship is locked up so seeking a real connection requires the melodrama.

For me, I had this realization remembering when he walked into Leblanc the first time. He sees Futaba and he says "You must be Wakaba Isshiki's daughter" and then after he gets chewed out by Sojiro, he starts talking about how he doesn't feel wanted anywhere. Then seemingly unrelated, he talks about his mom. It feels to me like he's trying to say "if you can care about Futaba, then you should care about me."

He hasn't had a support system, so the need for just someone, anyone to care, even though they don't know him and what he's done, is so strong. He hates being pitied because he doesn't see himself as weak, and he doesn't think he deserves sympathy, so why would he share anything more than necessary? The third semester is the inverse of this. Everyone knows too much, so now the care he craved for so long feels way too exposed. It's too vulnerable, and he never thought he would have earned it if he shared this much, even from Ren. So ultimately the trust he earned has the opposite effect, and now his prior "see me and love me" mask has been replaced by a "leave me alone and hate me" mask.

Just said something about this on twitter but out of everything in 3rd semester that’s meant to show the contrast between akechis behavior pre-engineroom and post-engineroom I honestly think this specific change in sprite expression does it best

The first one looks directly at you because he makes this face when he’s trying to gain sympathy points / connect with whoever he’s talking to. Okay yeah he uses it when he was talking about his mother at leblanc and the bathhouse which definitely drew from a place real sadness but it was still a calculated part of his attempts to endear himself. And the second one is the exact opposite. It barely shows up and when it does it’s only for 1-2 (?) dialogue boxes a piece. It’s the expression he makes when he can’t immediately hide his emotions. The quick turning away / avoidance of eye contact is so you Don’t connect with the little hints of genuineness that manage to slip out for the two seconds that they last. Maybe so he doesn’t have to see your face if you do? Anyway. TDLR I just think it’s nice to focus less on his crazy talk and meangirlisms and acknowledge that they’re 100% also being used to rein in the fact that he’s progressively losing his grip on masking “the real akechi” from sight 100% of the time. At every point in the game he only wants his real self to be seen in tiny, entirely controlled sneak peeks, and only when he thinks it benefits him. agh

Hear me out- I was thinking about how in Strikers all the Thieves have different outfits, and notably Makoto seems to have become much more comfortable in her own skin and expressing herself that way. She's literally wearing a crop pleather jacket, and she ROCKS it. So what I'm saying is, if Haru tried pastel goth, she would be sold. She would be immediately and irreversibly sold and would never go back.

The funniest thing about this to me is thinking about this with makoharu. Whether or not you ship it, it's still funny to me that it's literally just:

Punk biker butch lesbian and her pastel goth plant girlfriend who chops firewood as a hobby and is also secretly a butch.

Like- they are practically a lesbian stereotype checklist, it's so funny to me. I love them so much

I agree with this completely, but I want to add some things. I think something that I've seen people not realize is that in this framework Maruki has no care for the dead. He never cared about Kasumi, or about the sibling's bond with each other, because if he did he could have just brought Kasumi back or tried even a little bit to understand the underlying truth behind Sumire's grief stricken warped perception of her late sister. Instead, Maruki facilitates what she claims she wants, which is to become this warped perception of her sister. To match the strength she idolized. It's the same with Akechi. Akechi's wishes don't matter, Maruki wants to repay Ren for unintentionally giving him the key to accomplishing his goals, and to an extent he sees himself in Ren. Just like how Maruki didn't attempt to understand the truth behind the bond of the Yoshizawa siblings, he didn't attempt to understand the bond between Ren and Akechi. It's not enough that Akechi is alive and """"happy"""" with Ren, they had a unique dynamic fueled by their experiences, and Maruki's shallow understanding of them and what they "want" could never accurately replicate it. He thinks sanding off Akechi's jaded worldview and trauma will make him easier to love, and we know that's not true. Not to Ren. Akechi's autonomy is not granted to him because it would in Maruki's eyes, defeat the purpose of bringing him back as the perfect companion he thinks Ren always wanted but could never have.

This is a big reason why I have problems with people who claim to love shuake but also believe Maruki is right or prefer the bad ending narrative wise. It's feeding into the same toxicity Maruki does. Maruki doesn't value Akechi individually, he is only present as a ghostly giftwrapped puppet for Ren to love. People tend to fall into the trap that Maruki's reality provides, and that's that "look at this character you have grown attached to. Don't you want them happy?" So they are forced to deal with the cognitive dissonance of safe comfort for the character, or what the character would want. Anyone who claims to love Akechi and Ren together but prefers the bad ending doesn't actually care about the bond they have. It's because they play as Ren and they want his "happiness".

Adding onto this because I've yapped for this long so I might as well, I could apply this to any of the other thieves as well. Someone might spend the entire game wishing for Ann to be happy with Shiho, and then when Maruki provides that of course they would consider accepting the deal. But they seem to forget that the only reason they became attached to Ann in the first place is because of the experiences she went through in the course of the game. The Ann they grew to love is NOT the Ann that has Shiho in Maruki's reality. It's an important distinction to make.

forever thinking about royal’s bad ending. my thing with it is that maruki doesn’t necessarily give anyone what they want most, he gives them what’s most appropriate for them to want within a maruki-approved framework. iirc there’s a really interesting text sequence in the game where he just straight up changes someone’s career because they’re not “good” at it, regardless of whether that’s what they actually want. why struggle at all? ever? right?

and so ultimately i don’t think goro akechi’s greatest wish is necessarily ren. i think it’s a wish for sure, but his greatest wish is his own agency. despite any regrets he has and the fact that shido and yaldabaoth treated him like a pawn, he's generally pretty adamant about owning his choices and their consequences. he doesn't want that erased. and instead, you end up with pleasant boy™ if you take maruki’s deal. maybe maruki (incorrectly) thinks sanding off all of akechi’s rough edges will make him easier for ren to love. but the crux of it is really that maruki has to essentially lobotomize him to preserve the illusion of his perfect reality, because their ideologies are so diametrically opposed that akechi would spend every waking moment fighting back.

this isn’t to undermine ren’s importance to akechi btw — he explicitly acknowledges that he wishes they had met earlier, and there are countless moments throughout their confidant that underscore how much it means to him that they mirror each other so well. he absolutely does want more time with ren, just not under these circumstances.

and that’s also what makes ren’s choice on 2/2 doubly devastating. he knows that either way he loses akechi. and if he takes maruki’s deal, he loses him knowing that his last moments with the real akechi involved the two of them being unforgivably out of sync.

The two characters I thought of immediately:

i love when a character has something terrible happen to them and as a result they see themself as, essentially if not literally, a ghost. and so that means they only can (and have to) do what ghosts do, ie get revenge and then cease to exist. easy as that. but then halfway through this ghost vengeance they realize hey actually i might still be a human person. with human needs. that’s incredibly inconvenient, considering how much i’ve invested in this whole ghost thing

any1 have good akechi/shake songs (mainly focused on akechi)

also if any of these songs do not fit as much as I thought they did tell me pretty please this needs to be as lore accurate as possible or I will. explode.

i love this meme also ive been listening to bakenohana ffor like 3 hours

made one of those decoden phone cases :p